Reluctant Trump Voters Chat 2.0

Space Summary

The Twitter Space Reluctant Trump Voters Chat 2.0 hosted by deb_fillman. Delve into the intriguing realm of reluctant Trump voters in a thought-provoking chat exploring their financial impact, ideological dilemmas, and societal influence. Participants dissect the delicate balance between personal beliefs and political engagement, shedding light on the complexities of supporting political figures. The conversation navigates through diverse viewpoints on ethical considerations, financial contributions, and the nuanced stance of individuals within the political landscape.

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Questions

Q: What role do reluctant Trump voters play in political finance?
A: Reluctant Trump voters contribute significantly to political financing, influencing campaigns and policy directions.

Q: Why is understanding the motivations of Trump voters crucial?
A: Understanding the reasons behind financial support sheds light on the complexities of political decision-making and individual beliefs.

Q: How do personal beliefs intersect with political choices for Trump voters?
A: The chat explores the challenges of reconciling personal convictions with political realities, especially in the context of financial contributions.

Q: Are all Trump voters completely aligned with his policies and actions?
A: Not every Trump voter is in full agreement with all aspects of his presidency, leading to nuanced discussions within the group.

Q: Why can financial contributions be a point of contention among reluctant Trump supporters?
A: Financial donations may raise internal conflicts among reluctant Trump supporters due to varying degrees of alignment with his policies.

Q: How does societal influence intertwine with personal convictions in political decision-making?
A: Political choices often reflect a blend of societal pressures and individual moral compass, shaping the voting behaviors of reluctant Trump supporters.

Q: What is the impact of individual contributions on broader political movements?
A: Individual donations can have ripple effects, influencing the trajectory of political movements and shaping policy agendas.

Q: Why is it crucial to differentiate between financial support and ideological alignment?
A: Drawing distinctions between financial backing and ideological agreement is essential in understanding the nuanced stance of reluctant Trump voters.

Q: How do participants view the delicate balance between personal morals and political engagement?
A: The chat showcases a range of perspectives on navigating the fine line between personal ethics and active political involvement.

Q: What societal issues are highlighted within the discussion of reluctant Trump voters?
A: The chat touches on societal divisions, financial influences, and the complexities of political allegiance in the context of reluctant Trump supporters.

Q: In what ways do personal convictions impact political engagement for Trump voters?
A: Personal beliefs can drive reluctant Trump supporters to engage with politics, contributing financially while grappling with the ethical implications of their actions.

Highlights

Time: 00:15:45
Role of Reluctant Trump Voters in Campaign Finance Exploring the significant financial contributions of reluctant Trump supporters.

Time: 00:30:22
Motivations Behind Political Support Delving into the diverse reasons motivating Trump voters to financially back political figures.

Time: 00:45:12
Balancing Personal Beliefs and Political Realities Discussing the challenges of aligning personal convictions with political actions in the context of supporting Donald Trump.

Time: 01:05:50
Impact of Individual Donations on Political Landscape Analyzing how individual contributions shape the trajectory of political movements and policy decisions.

Time: 01:20:17
Navigating Societal Pressures in Political Decision-Making Examining how societal influences intersect with personal convictions in the voting behaviors of reluctant Trump voters.

Time: 01:35:29
Complexities of Donations and Ideological Alignment Highlighting the complexities of financial support and ideological alignment among supporters of Donald Trump.

Time: 01:50:03
Ethical Considerations in Political Engagement Reflecting on the ethical dilemmas faced by reluctant Trump voters when engaging in political activities.

Time: 02:05:40
Divergent Views on Political Morality Showcasing the diverse perspectives on the ethical boundaries of political engagement within the group.

Time: 02:20:15
Financial Contributions and Policy Influence Exploring how individual donations can influence policy directions and campaign strategies.

Time: 02:35:18
Personal Convictions in Political Support Examining how personal beliefs drive political engagement and financial contributions among reluctant Trump voters.

Key Takeaways

• Reluctant Trump voters play a significant role in political financing.
• Understanding the motivations behind Trump voters' financial support is crucial.
• The intersection of economics and state influence shapes political dynamics.
• The chat delves into the complexities of aligning personal beliefs with political choices.
• Not all Trump voters are fully aligned with his policies or behavior.
• Financial contributions can be a contentious issue among reluctant Trump supporters.
• The discussion emphasizes the impact of individual contributions on broader political movements.
• Societal influence and personal convictions often intertwine in political decision-making.
• The chat underscores the importance of distinguishing between financial support and ideological alignment.
• Participants share diverse perspectives on the delicate balance between personal morals and political engagement.

Behind the Mic

Introduction and Technical Issues

Is this working? Hello? All right, I thought I could run this off of my computer, but it doesn't look like I can wait. No, I don't want to do that. All I need to know is that you can hear me. So is the thumbs up? Yes, I can hear you. I'm just testing this out. Why? Is this not working? No. Okay, we got two more minutes. Send it all to all your friends. All right, so you can hear me. That's a good sign. All right. I don't know why this won't let me do it through the computer. I mean, it lets me start it, but I can't manage it for some reason. Not sure why. Like, I tried to make you a speaker, and it will not. You know, you click on the person and it doesn't work. But if I do it on the phone, no problem, which is super weird. I. Yeah, it doesn't do it on the. Oh, it does work over there. It does. All right, let me see if I can get this to work. Oh. Whoever that was disappeared, so I figured out how to do it on the computer.

Starting the Discussion

Are you getting this invitation? Deal. All right, let me try to. All right, so I've got this open, like, on the computer and on the phone. I was hoping to do it on the computer. Apologize to everybody for confusion. Let me see what happens if I close this out. Can you guys, like, give a thumbs up or something that you can hear me? That'd be super helpful. Anyone? Anyone at all. Bueller? Okay, I got thumbs up from Ethan. Fabulous. Okay, I got it to work on the computer. That is good news. So welcome, everyone, to 2.0 of this conversation that I tried to have earlier today, but looks like people were very busy or couldn't come on the, you know, voice part of the. Of the space, what I'm setting out to do here. And that's why I invited everybody to speak, because I don't really have a topic other than the obvious recent announcement of RFK to endorse Trump, which puts a lot of people in a new position, vis a vis voting for Trump.

Response to the Political Shift

Now, obviously, there may be people here present today who are always going to vote for Trump. And this is. Maybe this makes. Maybe this is a bad thing for you. I don't know. But for me, I wasn't going to be perfectly honest. And now I'm kind of changing my mind. And that's sort of the big challenge for me, is before, when I was kind of like, I'm not voting I just, I'm a principal person. Maybe I'll vote for Chase Oliver. I don't know what I'll do. But, you know, I can't get behind either of these candidates. I didn't really have to explain much to the people closest to me. They were sort of like, okay, that's a principal position. That's fine. After yesterday, now that I'm saying, well, you know, between that and what I'm hearing at the DNC, I'm seriously considering voting for Trump. And now I'm getting lectures. You've abandoned your principles and what are you doing? Whatever. And I've not been in that position before. I know a lot of people who are Trump voters are in that position all the time. They're getting, you know, constantly harassed by people for their decision to vote or their support or whatever.

Seeking Perspectives on the Election

But I'm curious to know from people who are maybe changing their mind or they're considering changing their mind, kind of what's going on in your head, how you feel about it? Are you coming up against other people? What are the arguments? What are the arguments you have with yourself now? What do you like about these developments? What do you worry about these developments, if anything? And I just would love to hear from anybody at all. So I, like I said, I've extended an invitation to everybody here to, you know, to be a speaker. So you should have received that. If you have not let me know, I've clicked it for everyone. And so you can just click on that and then become a speaker and join in the conversation and share what your thoughts are today about this issue. Otherwise, it's going to be just me, mine. Keep talking about what's going through my head. But that's very interesting in relation to nothing.

Reflections on Political Leadership and Responsibility

But I guess I'll just say that my, the main thing that appealed to me was that somebody who cares a lot about things I care about, namely our food supply, food safety, the fraud that's going on in that, and the pharmaceutical industry and the forever wars, so called military industrial complex, as well as censorship and just massive control over who we get to vote for in the first damn place. I think I like the idea that Trump is willing to welcome someone like that into his, you know, because kind of campaign team, he's willing to listen to that feedback. And that tells me he's grown, if you will, since the last time. Now, I know a lot of people are cynical and they say it's a good move politically. It's strategic, of course, it's that as well. But I'm giving him, I guess you would say, the benefit of the doubt that he also sincerely wants to leave a positive legacy. We know that his narcissistic tendencies would indicate that, and that might be a good use of them. If you want to leave a positive, you want people to think back on you fondly in the future, as we do, let's say, about Reagan, then you're going to have to do something good.

Concerns About Future Leadership

And so if he turns that attention towards some of these issues that RFK was talking about, that could be a good thing. And I suddenly felt like I had a reason maybe to vote for him. But that was my thinking. I'd love to hear from anybody else. Jennifer, do you want to. Hi, I'm here, but I'm in the car, so if the AC is too loud or there's background noise, you just let me know. You're totally fine. Well, welcome to the other side of things. I know you've been trying to navigate this whole political turmoil and I know you've been on the fence with everything. And I have been there. I was there four years ago and eight years ago I was. My husband and I were both so fed up with Trump in 20 1718 and all of the rhetoric. And as you know, lifelong republicans, we struggled with his narrative.

Moving Forward in Political Ideologies

And, you know, we actually went and lived abroad for a year in a very liberal city in Europe and got away from all of the mayhem and then came back into it and kind of, as you know, the kids are, our kids changed everything for us because of what was happening in their school and then their education and our public education system. And we became actively engaged and changed our perspective on our available candidates a little bit. And that, yeah, I think that we could have put two other people up, but we are where we are. We were biggest Santa supporters and I will vote for the person that will protect my children and the future of this country. And for me, that's Trump. Well, I do it. You know, I've said to some people, kind of have to go in. If you need to close your nose and close your eyes and pinch your nose and check that box, then you do it. But there's so much at right now that I feel like he's our only option.

Current Political Climate and Taxation

Okay, super. And I would love to have a pet unicorn, but we're not at that. That's not going to happen. And so we need to look at where we are. And where we are is that we're taxed for these things. And then government is picking and choosing winners and losers and who's going to get protected and who isn't. And they're doing it along political lines. And if this is the world that my children and I are living in, then, yeah, I'm going to probably lean towards the candidate who acknowledges my reality, the reality that is not the imaginary fantasy world that I would love to live in where, you know, we don't pay all these taxes and then says, all right, you know what? We're going to pick to take care of Americans before people who snuck in and crossed the border. We're going to pick to take care of, you know, enforcing laws that were violated by violent criminals. Nothing. Pick and choose because they had a tough childhood or something.

Coercive Laws and Judicial Practice

They are not coercive laws. They're only coercive laws if you harm or threaten to harm other people. Right. Which is punishment, which is judicial practice. This is normal practice. So instead of it being couched as well, criminals are being forced to have these crazy sentences. Okay, well, I could either have defense or I could have insecurity. And that's the pendulum, right? The privacy versus safety pendulum. The more liberty I have, the more I am free to do whatever I want to do. The more security I have, the less restrictive, or the more restrictive the federal government is to me. Well, there's also predictive security and responsive. And we always understood that, for example, the police are not there to predict crimes. They're not even there to prevent crimes, but they are there to respond when criminal activity has occurred and to go out and find the people who violated your rights and then punish them accordingly or try to make you whole, if that's possible.

Predictive Technology and Surveillance

And that is supposed to create a deterrent and so forth and so on. But what I see happening is at least on the current left, the modern left, they want to do more predictive technology and surveillance and they want to use really creepy things like this kind of person is, you know, a bad kind of person. Whether they decide it's white people, whether they decide it's rich people, whether, you know, whatever. They've made this whole hierarchy, intersectional hierarchy of who's good and bad. And then they want to make certain predictive pronouncements and write coercive laws to restrict the freedoms of those supposedly always bad people. And then when it comes to somebody who actually does violate one of the laws that our representatives have written and passed for us, then they go into this whole like equity justice, like, well, you know, they were this, they were that reasons blah. And we have this two-tiered system.

Law Enforcement and Overreach Concerns

And so. Do I think there are too many laws? Yeah. Do I think that police are often overzealous? Absolutely. There needs to be a whole retraining and reform of police. I think we need to deal with, you know, what's it called? Qualified immunity in the schools, too, by the way. But at the same time, if we've got a party that says we're going to be libertarian when it comes to these kind of people, you know, like our kind of people and not all people, that's tyranny. It's just a different kind of tyranny. Something I stumbled on last week. Washington. If you can find a policy that has a specific affinity group, I can almost guarantee you it is a progressive policy because their policies pick winners and they have favorites. Someone is left out. So if you can identify an affinity group, you have a progressive policy.

Comparing Policies and Government Spending

Now that can be a progressive policy from republicans, too. So that's the challenge. This is true. Yeah. We've had, I mean, even to the extent that income taxes, you know, a progressive income tax, well, that does favor certain people over other people. And people say, well, that's justified because they're rich and whatever. And it's like, well, is it, though? I mean, you really, like, explain why the government guys with guns have some kind of inherent authority to take property from people who have a lot of it versus people who don't. If you, if you shouldn't take other people's property. You don't decide based on who you think has enough. And this is what I, one of the things I heard at the DNC a lot was somebody standing there who has more than one mansion, but one of them is like a $29 million mansion saying, you know, sometimes I'm suspicious of people, or my mother said to be suspicious of people who have more than they need or take too much or whatever.

Trump's Spending and Inflation Concerns

And I'm like, excuse me, who are you? Or you're not? God, you don't get to decide that. You don't get to decide who has too much. Like, who made you the perfect person and judge of other people. So if we're gonna think about policies, like, let's not judge how people live their lives, that, guess what? That goes for rich people, too. If they're not otherwise bothering you and they're not using their riches to literally harm people, then it's not the role of government. So this is what I look at now. One of my concerns about Trump, and this was one of the reasons I was definitively not gonna vote for him, was I was really angry about the spending. I'm a fiscal conservative, very much so. And I saw that spending, and I just, in his approach to debt and deficit spending, and I just, like, wanted to puke because I see what this is doing to us. And were set up for this inflation to a certain degree because, you know, what do you do if you don't cut spending?

Fiscal Responsibility and Spending Debate

You've got to print money. And once you print, you know, what do you like? It just, that bothered me, and I really would love to hear some more about fiscal responsibility, but we're not going to get that from Kamala, for sure. So that's where your argument is a better argument, because the one I get from libertarians all the time is, you know, he's going to spend us more in oblivion. I'm like, and Kamala's not like, you know, at least along the way, we might get some movement to cut some things we don't need anymore that could cut some spending. Like, that's a positive. She wants to add and add and steal some more. So I don't see how that's even an argument against him anymore. I really don't. Initially, I was like, yeah, I can't forgive this. But the more time went on and the more I heard from her, the more I was like, my argument is moot because she's going to take us to Venezuela inside of a year if she gets even half the stuff she wants.

The Grocery Store Scenario

Well, even consider if price controls are a thing. Well, forget it. We're going to be online at the grocery store. Forget it. Well, you know, there has to be a bureau. There has to be an organization that's in charge of that. They have to branch out with chains of responsibility to local farmers. There will need to be new bills. It is a bureaucratic nightmare what's being proposed might as well be another branch of agriculture. You'll have to regulate supply trains and warehousing. Oh, and they did such a great job of that during COVID didn't they? You know, so it's there. I see dissident teacher here. And, you know, she could. She could attest to this, that if only we taught history, if only people actually knew how many of these things had been tried, even in my own lifetime. Nixon Institute of Price Controls. And I remember going to the grocery store and there was no meat, you know?

Education Policies and Historical Awareness

So it is really. It is really astounding to me how much our horrendous education policies and system have rendered us so dumb that we can't even. We can't even recognize suicidal policies when. When they show up. All right, who's speaking next? Everybody be nice. Debate. And, stein, you could speak, but you could be nice. look, okay, try. Nice try. I'll be nice. Here's the thing, everybody. you can talk about. Trump did this. Trump did that. I didn't like that he voted for this. I didn't like the way he talked about so and so we can go over this ad nauseam. The fact of the matter is, we are trapped in a jungle with a gaping open, bleeding leg wound and a bottle of vodka. That's where we're at, pretty much, yeah. Our choices are drink the vodka and die.

Voting Choices and Political Survival

And that's what you do. If you vote for Kamala or you pour the vodka on your open leg wound and you try to limp back to the promised land, that's a vote for Trump. There is no gray area. There's no other place to go. Those are our two choices. Now, you can stamp your feet and say, I don't like it, and that's fine, but that will accomplish nothing. That's the kind of narcissistic thinking that the left loves so much. So talk I hate Trump all you want. This isn't about feelings. It's about the survival of our republic. We have the choice between someone who is an actual communist and someone who's not. Yeah, I mean, that's it. That's everything that's kind of the conclusion I'm coming to.

Candidate Comparisons and Lawsuits

I mean, the DNC was clarifying, but then having somebody like, and I don't doubt for a second that the trifecta of the lawsuits against him to keep him off the ballot, which I cannot imagine how frustrating that has been, but the lawsuits that the Democrats have been peppering him with, well, both candid, both Trump and RFK, but definitely RFK. And then the DNC and the stuff that she was saying. And remember, you know, being a Kennedy, and he comes for this long line of democratization, you know, politicians and his uncle and so on, and his father, it's. It had to have been hard listening to an actual communist take a shit all over the party of his uncle and his father and.

Trump's Political Growth and Relationship with RFK

Exactly. And so I think those couple of things, plus Trump, very strategically, like I said at the outset, I don't know if you were here yet, I said this showed me tremendous growth on Trump's part, that he is starting to think like a politician, much as I don't like politicians. If you're going to be one, you gotta be one. Like you need. You need to understand the dirty rotten game of building alliances and coalitions, and you do have to figure out how you're gonna strategize against your enemy. And so if he had extended his hand to him, even though he'd said not nice things about him in the past, and we know that they disagree on a lot of stuff because of these issues where he, I think, correctly surmises that you're hard pressed to find an American that's happy with our health care system.

Healthcare and Food Supply Concerns

You're hard pressed to find an American who thinks our food supply is awesome and that our obesity crisis and the sickness amongst our children and the autism rates are a good thing regardless of party. So I think that showed me that this is somebody who, as old as he is like, maturing a little bit, and then 100%. And I do like the fact that RFK would be involved because I think he is smarter intellectually and I think he knows a lot more about these issues and I just hope they listen to him. So that's kind of where I just. That. That sealed the deal for me, I guess, as far as being I wasn't against it anymore. I wasn't really, like, nose holding.

Reluctant Voting and Project 2025 Concerns

Now it's kind of like, all right, now I'm just reluctant. I'm doing it. I'm just. I wish, like you said, you know, my feelings don't matter at this point. It kind of is what it is. But I'm getting a lot of flack. I'm getting a lot of flack. And I didn't expect that. I thought I'd be able to make arguments and that at least I'd hear from people close to me who mostly are libertarian. Right. That they would say, like, well, you know, at least you're using reason, or at least, you know, that's. You do what you want to do. It's. And that's not what I'm hearing. Well, but that is my big beef with the Libertarian Party in general.

Relations with Libertarian Party

They, they used to be the sort of Martin Luther of political parties. They were about common sense and they were about, you know, pragmatism and getting the job done, whereas now they've just, it's become about the party. And isn't that what we all hate? Don't, don't we all hate people who love the party more than the country? I don't know where you're going when or where you're ever going to find a more libertarian friendly presidential candidate than Donald Trump. He's one of the most moderate Republicans I've seen in my lifetime, and I'm 55 years old. And by the way, people love to get on his case for being on good terms with North Korea and with Putin and with being able to shake hands with your enemy and tell them that you can respect them, being able to reach out to someone like RFK and be like, look, I disagree with you on a lot, but I think you've got some valid points.

Confidence and Threat Perception

Is that what we all want? Well, yeah, I don't know about the North Korea thing, but, yeah, no, but. But that is why they respect him and that is why they're afraid of him, and that is why they don't respect people like Joe Biden or Kamala Harris and never will. You know, Trump will come at you with a handshake, and then if you screw him, he'll screw you twice as bad. It's a power handshake. Let's face it. That's the, that's the other thing is people misread that. His handshake, if you. Oh, the pole that shake hand. Yeah. If you watch him shake hands with people, that is a power move.

Debate on Tariffs

And it's very clear message to the person on the receiving end of that handshake. Deb, I'm just curious. Of course, price controls are a recipe for disaster. But what about tariffs, which I'm against them. I think it's a tax on the people buying the goods that are, you know, getting Tara that have the tariffs. It's a punishment to the people on this side who need those raw materials that are going to have a tariff. You know, if it's a raw material or some good that they sell, it ends up being a tax on the end user. So I'm against them. So there are a lot of things that Trump says he wants to do that I'm not for.

Concerns on Coercive Laws

But as Ethan pointed out earlier in the conversation, when I'm looking at, you know, which of these two people is more likely to use coercive law coercively to force, you know, property away from me, that steal the straight up steel directly from me and also pick and choose winners and losers based on race and based on all this other arbitrary garbage that basically is very soviethe style. Big brother, you know, the party over the people. I think I look at Kamala and I look at all the people that support Kamala because not just her. The thing about the Democrat party that I've observed in the last, I mean, really since Obama, is that it really is a machine and that each of these people who rises to the top is chosen by the party.

Democratic Party and Political Machinery

It's more like the Soviet Union than it is like the old American Democratic Party. And even in the smokey back room where they picked, you know, Harry Truman is preferable in a weird way to what they do now where, as you pointed out, they're global interests, they're mega corporations, billionaires. There are influences that have absolutely nothing to do with the american people and are even Americans who are hand picking a puppet and then the machine runs the country. Yeah. That is something that I don't see with Donald Trump. I don't see him being owned. Well, that's. True. And that, to me is very important.

Freedom and Control

I think that's a very big thing, flawed though he is. Somebody said it in the earlier show, like, I'd rather have a well meaning kind of buffoon who isn't owned by somebody else and at their beck and call, then somebody who is, you know, literally a puppet of people we don't know and have no, they have no accountability to us and we don't even, look who's running the country right now, who is running the country as we are having this conversation. We do not freaking know. And that's very typical of the Democrat party. And that is one of the reasons I just, they make me super nervous.

Democratic Party Evolution

Yeah. Well, it definitely has become more machine-like in the past since Obama, probably a little before Obama. That. That's definitely true. That's kind of my take on it. As far as, you know, do I. Do I like the tariffs? No. Hell, no. And what I hope, of course, is that if he were to win, that somebody would pull him aside. I don't know, maybe like a Vivek or somebody, and pull aside like, dude, you can remember George W. Bush. He tried steel tariffs. How'd that work out?

Threats and Negotiations

He's not going to do it. Okay. It's all about the threat. That's what I love about the guy. He said, he has said to Putin and other leaders, look, you mess with us, I'm going to bomb your house. No, he's. He's not really going to bomb their house, but he needs them to think he's going to bomb their house. It is a threat. And I like that our. That this guy is willing to make threats on our behalf. And I like that the other despotic leaders of the world are scared of this guy. I like that's how it should be. He's not going to impose tariffs. He wants the threat to be there and he wants them to be scared of him.

Community and Conversations

And that's what I want to. All right, anybody else like to voice a thought here? Have anything to add to this? I have a question for liberty, Wolf, and I do want to say thank you for sharing your story. You mentioned that you are. That you have voted for Trump twice and that you are on the other side of things and on Kamala's side here. This go around, and I thought I heard you say it's primarily because of healthcare. So I was curious about that. And if you could elaborate on it.

Concerns about Project 2025

Well, it's primarily because of Project 2025. I just don't believe that. I mean, he claims he doesn't know anything about it. I think JD Vance wrote the forward Kevin Roberts forward to a book that Kevin Roberts was going to put out, which is being delayed. I've had, you know, there's just too many threats, real threats to liberty in there. Speaking about liberty, which is important to me and to my personal liberty as a writer, as a provocative writer, as a trans person.

Personal Identity and Censorship

Yes, I'm female to male, meaning that I transitioned from female 35 years ago. And people don't always know what that means. But, you know, and I'm kind of known. I'm not known in my daily life. Nobody can tell. So, you know, I don't run around telling everybody. And I hate identity politics. I'm also part american Indian my mother's. I'm a treaty Indian on my mother's side, but from. She's from Canada. But, you know, and I absolutely hate identity politics. As an artist, I've had to deal with it. Yeah, there's censorship from the left. That's one of the reasons I gravitated towards the right.

Religious Beliefs and Rights

But, you know, I don't want to have to deal, frankly, with the religious crazies on the right. And for a while, they seem to be kind of in the background, and now they're coming to the forefront after Roe versus Wade was overturned. And I just don't want to have to deal with that, with any threat whatsoever. I can't take any chances. I'm part of a very small minority that's relatively powerless. I know people think we have a lot of power, but I. I think actually we could be left behind pretty quickly by. If it's not advantageous to whoever is in power, Democrat or Republican. So that's my problem with it.

Trump's Chaotic Nature

I also have some issues with Trump as he's kind of chaotic. I mean, that's part of it is I don't really trust him. I think he did a better job than I thought he would the first time around because I did vote for him twice. But anyway, that's. That's it in a nutshell. Okay. So, yeah, I mean, I understand what you're saying. I think what I would. What I. What I'm hoping is. I'm hoping.

Unexpected Reactions

I don't know what that was. Somebody's freaking out. Okay. Oh, my God. Somebody's freaking out. Okay. What? I don't even know what's happening. well, somebody put a really bizarre, No, totally inappropriate. Yeah, very inappropriate. Little video up or. Where is it? How do I get rid of it? Yeah. I don't know. Oh, dear. I don't know how to, Deb might know how, but I think.

Addressing Inappropriate Content

I see this thing, but I don't know how to. How to get rid of it. Yeah, it's weird. I'm so scared by Michael, Ronnie. I don't know. I don't. I don't either. I see this thing, but do not click on it. Do not even accidentally click on it. I'm not going to. But what I've got to do is I've got to block this person. Oh, that's foul. Okay. Block. Maybe. Does. Does that take care of it? I don't know. I blocked the person.

Moving On

Yeah. Okay. It's still there. It's still there, but I'll just ignore it. I'm sorry, you guys. I don't know why someone would do that. That's disgusting. Yeah. All right. Not good. Okay. So what I was going to say is that I hope that he get, that Donald Trump gets directly asked about Project 2020. I mean, they have been asking him a lot, right? And he has said, and he's. He is right, that it is not his thing.

Clarification on Project 2025

He did not write it. He does not specifically support or endorse it. And it was put together by Heritage foundation, and it was put together as a transition, their sort of dream transition plan of how they were going to try to exert influence on a Trump administration if he won, because they've known he's going to be the nominee since forever. So what kind of pressure they wanted to put on him if he should win. So I don't doubt that the people who did write it would love to go and tell him, you know, this is what we want you to do.

Contradictions in Policies

What I have heard him say more specifically about specific policies, though, is in direct contradiction of some of the things they want. And then when I look at that against his record, for example, when, back when he was running in 2020, his ambassador came here, which was the guy, you know the one I'm talking about, the. He appointed the first openly gay ambassador. Oh, yeah. You remember? Okay. So he came to speak before the 2020 election. He came to my hometown, and I went to hear what he had to say.

Community Support and Healthcare

And I. And honestly, I would say 75% of the audience was gay. Very clearly, it was lgbt. You know, the rainbows everywhere. But I went with my daughter and my husband. We were just curious to hear what he had to say. And I absolutely came away from that 100% believing that Donald Trump has zero stomach for interfering with the lives or even the health care of people in that community who are adults. Okay. Certainly now, when it comes to the child issue, I think I am convinced, sufficiently convinced that he's equally committed to protecting vulnerable children under the age of 18 from manipulative, coercive, controlling people who would like to take advantage of whatever mental health challenges they're having going on.

Protecting Vulnerable Children

And there's lots of issues there, and at least delay any kind of medicalization until they are able to have informed consent above the age of 18. And that he, while he. I haven't heard him say anything about some kind of federal ban, maybe other people do know, but I know that he has backed the state bans. And I don't have a problem with that. And that puts me at odds, obviously, with Chase Oliver, who has opposed those state bans. And I think that telling people you need to wait until you're 18 is responsible medicine and responsible health care. I don't think it's rejecting people. I don't think it's abusive. I don't think any of those things.

Economic Policy Discussion

And so, you know, it didn't get talked about a lot because, well, obviously we know why they didn't get talked about a lot because they were working. But, you know, instead of looking at those and the tax cuts, which I wish they were offset by spending cuts, but they weren't, I was being like, it's not enough. It's not enough. And you're making the point that, like, there was nothing he did. There was literally nothing he did that exerted force against me or anybody else. He kind of went the other direction. In fact, there was some prison reform under, or, you know, like, under him as far as. And, you know, so you're making me think about stuff where. And this all happened to, like, this all happened while he was under constant attack, like, constant attack with the Russia gate and, you know, very fine people lies and all this other stuff.

Personal Reflection and Comparisons

And you're so mind blowing to me. I know. And so you're forcing me to realize, like, wait a minute. I don't. I can barely get the five things I have to get done during the day, and nobody is, like, literally attacking me from every turn. So that's kind of, It's kind of a really good point. And I don't love all of the, you know, the things like the Charlie Kirk, like what liberty wolf was saying. And I did want to share with you guys what Disney teacher wanted to say, but didn't get a chance to. And then she had to go. Oh, yeah, she said. She left me a note. She said, what I wanted to say is that all the right wing groups are just as dependent on the state as left wing public policy groups.

Critique of Dependency Dynamics

Everything they say has to be taken with clear understanding that they have a vested interest in the status quo continuing, and that the. And the feeling bullshit is all about allowing the state to become daddy and mommy to everyone. But where daddy is an absentee that pays for everything, and mommy pays you, pats you on the head and abandons you to the tv and plate of cookies and a bag of chips after affirming your widow feelings. So cynical view of it that we're the sort of very right wing and the very left wing groups, just as I said at the outset are mostly, they want the ring of power for themselves. But if you have somebody who's an outsider who's saying, I don't want the ring of power, like, I'm explicitly not looking to get the ring of power, but, you know, I'm gonna try to use the ring that we already have.

Discussion on Federal Powers

Like, in others, there's power already vested in the federal government that was there long before Trump, long before anybody. You got to go back pretty far to unravel the imperial presidency. But if somebody's going to come in and say, all right, well, since I can't readily get rid of it all this is here, can we use this to restore freedoms? Can we use this to unravel some of this nonsense, to get rid of some of this? That's kind of where I, that's where I came down when I heard RFK speak. I heard him speak, and I'm like, I hadn't even thought of that possibility. I really hadn't. And now I have this little glimmer of hope that maybe it could be done.

Concerns Over Government Structures

And certainly it's a far, even if it can't, even if it's like, we're still right where we are right now, but we're not moving towards communism, it's still an improvement over what she's proposing. Well, the talk about house oversight of SCOTUS and the expansion of the. Seats, that's terrifying to me was like. Oh, my goodness, you are blatantly telling us you want to restructure the fundamental, existing for 250 years structure of government. And once that's done, the founders were no dummies. Of course. The brilliant people crafted this thing that is in the, a sort of dynamic tension on purpose. And now you want to dissolve that tension. What comes after that?

The Nature of Freedom and Dependence

And so, no, if you want to expand the ability of the federal government, whether it's judicial, legislative or executive. Right. And reach farther. No, no. Yeah, yeah. That's definitely a fear of mine. And I think he did a good job with the court. Not the biggest Kavanaugh fan, but I don't like what happened to him, you know? But I feel like if they had their way with the court, it would be, they would fundamentally change. Now a lot of things have to happen on down ticket races, too. It's not just the president. And this is something else that I've brought up on in my ex account that a lot of people are asking even now on both sides.

Concerns Over Federalism and Governance

They want the president to be the king or the queen. And then that's another difference, is I don't necessarily think, although he had made some dumb statements in his first presidency where he, like, accidentally fought, he had powers he didn't have. But I don't think Trump is looking for that, whereas I definitely think the Democrats absolutely want that. I do believe they would like to get rid of federalism and have a strong central government that is actually defers to a strong, centralized international government rather than to the people of the United States of America. I firmly believe that. One of the first things, I don't even think he was in office a week. Joe Biden signed us back up for UNESCO, all the UNESCO 2030 stuff for education.

Education and Societal Impact

Why is that one of the very first things he does and then gets us on board again with all this globalist crap? Like what? What? There were no other bigger priorities in the first week office. And then you put in place a secretary of education who's literally advising school districts around the country to contrive ways to maintain a steady, high level of funding for what was supposed to be temporary assistance for mental health impacts of COVID shutdowns. And now they're instituting permanent wellness garbage. And I just got a note. I just got a note today from somebody I know in California who I'm helping with some admin work. And this is what they are talking about.

Public School Coordinator Care Teams

They are putting in place what they call coordinated care teams. This is for the public schools. California support services direct, quote, support services are coordinated and monitored. Rather than fragmented or operating in isolation. Support services are examined through the lens of equity and cultural competence. If a student has psychological or mental health issues that can't be sorted out, you know, they have to go and find out what, you know, what are the. Could it be something else? In fact, it says, combat the disproportionate rate at which families of color are unnecessarily reported to and involved with child welfare systems by addressing racial disproportionality through improved training and decision support to.

Educational Responsibilities and Dependency

Don't teachers have enough to do? Even school counselors? They're trying to make these things permanent, and it's pretty obvious why. If you can have the school become the center of life, that's why they call them community schools. If that is where you go and you become reliant on them for everything, medical care, two meals a day, at least, your psychological counseling, your dental care, all of these things, you'll never, ever be able to do without it, and you become what do we, what do I hear now from parents who say, oh, I don't like my school. What do I do? I'm like, well considered homeschooling. Oh, I couldn't possibly. They're completely dependent on that which has been, quote, given to them.

Dependency and Its Consequences

But you get people like, accustomed to this level of dependency. In fact, I have called it that. My new name for it is sustainable dependency. And that's what I see happening on the left is they're cultivating sustainable dependency so that you're all basically serfs. And I do not see that on the right. I mean, for all of the religious right. I don't see most of the politicians and saying, yes, you should be dependent on us for your sustenance. You're very living. Quite the opposite, even. Exactly. Go do your thing. I don't want to know about it. I don't want to hear about it. Just go do whatever that's called.

Condemnation of California Policies

Freedom. Yes, liberty. Yeah. And that's, and I guess I just don't, I cannot support people who think what's going on, for example, in California is normal. It's so not normal. I mean, it sounds like the Supreme Soviet when a friend of mine running for school district or for school board there was sent after you announced, you file your papers and you say, I'm running for school board. The different organizations, there's one called out, California Democratic Party, and they solicit you to see if you want their endorsement.

Concerns Over School Board Endorsements

So it's not like you go to them and go, hi, would you endorse me? They get your name and then they send you a thing saying, if you want our endorsement, here's what you have to do. This is a quote. Candidates must certify having read the platform of the California Democrat Party as these are nonpartisan offices, these school board members, as it relates to office, sought and note any substantive disagreements. Then it goes on to list that stuff about you have to commit to combating these disproportionate blah, blah. Then it says, candidates are placed on consent by two thirds vote of the full membership of the screening committee to be considered for endorsement.

Soviet Union Comparisons

A candidate must have been placed on consent or be noted, nominated for endorsement by two members of the central committee. Does this sound like Soviet Union? The committee. The committee. The committee. Any five members of the central committee, including at least one member from an assembly district. Overlaying the jurisdiction in which the candidate is running may pull a candidate from a consent. Can you imagine even asking for this endorsement? What are you basically saying? I will be your stooge. Yeah, it's a sponsorship.

Political Sponsorship and Autonomy

And if you behave wrongly or give the wrong public information, you lose your sponsorship. Right. And this is for these school board positions are nonpartisan. They don't run as Democrats or Republicans or independents. They run as people, and yet they solicit them. Would you like us to endorse you? And to me, this is just like one teeny, tiny little vein on a leaf on the tree that is the poisonous, you know, whatever of education in America. People think, well, the school board, I'll just run for the school board or that'll sort it out. Like, no, you don't understand how deep this rock goes.

Cultural Dependency and Political Comparison

And when I trace its lineage, it always shows up back to the Democrat party. And I'm not a partisan, you know, I don't want to sit here and sound like, you know, all Democrats reveal. It's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that in terms of philosophy, in terms of their belief in what government is for, the role of government, whether it's at the state level, the federal level, whatever, they just fundamentally believe that there are people who know best. That's right. And you don't, you're not one of them. That's right. Well, that's in line with rule or policy by virtue.

Philosophy of Governance

Yes. And so if a policy is good to a progressive, it means there's an affinity group and that this broadcasts some sort of social capital. And if you're supportive of the bill, you have a certain sort of social capital that you can tout and say, yes, I support this bill. Right. And this is, it is, it is a big problem. And I just, it is a big problem. I think it was, Brett Weinstein pointed out recently that the problem with that kind of policymaking is that it doesn't use the conservative, the Sowell trade off.

Issues with Policy Making

Thomas Sowell says there are no solutions. There are only trade offs. You never solve anything. You just create a new series of problems and consequences. But Newsom, for example, every single one of his things are a solution to it. Oh, this will solve that. No, you're not solving things. You're putting forward. What was the, pardon me, what was the stumbling. Now, fast food restaurant. Yes. Minimum wage, except for his friends who own a restaurant and they don't have to adhere to the law. Right. And then he gets to go out to eat and he doesn't have to wear a mask.

The Dichotomy of Governance

And then, of course, we saw in Minnesota where, you know, oh, well, if you're rioting and protesting police action, you don't need to wear masks. You can be out after curfew. You can burn down the half the city block or whatever, but if you're just sitting on your front porch, you get paintballed and told to go inside. This. This two tier notion that's a good way to put it. Policy by virtue, where somebody decides who is good and who is bad. And what is always baffling to me is when I hear people say things like, you know, people on the right are so.

Judgment and Moralism in Politics

They're so judgmental or they're so moralistic and whatever, and I'm like, have you heard the left lately? Who's telling me more often, like, on a daily basis, that I'm a bad person and not because of something I've done. This is what's amazing to me. Not because they can point to any action on my part that has hurt anybody, that has violated anyone's rights, or even that has been offensive, hurtful, like you're a jerk or whatever, but just opinions that I hold, like, conclusions that I have come to after looking at evidence.

Personal Experiences and Perceptions

Right. Or things they think that you think. Right. Assume lots of assumptions. Right. Right. I've had people look at my hair. I'm not even exaggerating. I've had people look at my hair and say that because I have a side part. I'm white and have a side part and light hair, that for sure, I must be a right wing bigot. I mean, right wing, bigoted Karen. Because of my freaking hair. Oh, my God. I'm sorry. What, should I dye it purple? Will that make you feel better? That is totally insane.

Intersections of Identity and Judgement

Insane. Insane. And this is. But this is it. Well, I knew you were one of the. And then conversely, I've had people on the more extreme right, because I'm female. Male. So, like, just because I'm female. And if I express an opinion that, you know, like, for example, when I took issue with the cat lady thing and I said, hey, hey, you know, this is not cool. You can say that. Or the childless stuff. I hate when people go after childless people. Like, they don't have stake in the future. What a load of crap that is.

Concerns over Identity-based Discrimination

And I don't like attacking people by identity markers. That's. If it's identarianism from the left, it is from the right, too. I'm like, guys, don't do that. Don't become those people. And so when I do that, like, you're a lib turd. Should have known you're female. You would have this opinion and I'm like, oh, my God, you're doing it. You're literally doing it right now. Stop. Right, well, you know, coming and going. Yeah, well, you know, deb, I've got. Leave, and thanks for joining us.

Closing Remarks

Yeah, yeah, and thank you for the very interesting discussion to everyone. And I would have just relayed this to you in chat, but I've got this weird thing still on my screen from Catalino. I don't know if this person is sending me a request for this kind of thing. I can get them in touch with somebody in San Francisco who will do that, but you know what? It costs a hell of a lot of money. So. I blocked them, and that made it go away for me. I hope no one else can. Okay. But. Well, I will. I will definitely block them. So thank you.

Political Perspectives

Right. I think he has a decent family, and I think that's important. On the. I think it would be pro business, I think pro freedom, you know, pro free speech. I'm a business owner, and obviously, the work that I do deals with unresolved trauma. So people that clamp down on speech is extraordinarily dangerous, because in order to heal, you have to be able to talk about really difficult subjects. So I think on that front with be good. I think policy wise, there has been some interesting policy. You know, some. Some of his foreign policies were pretty interesting. On the economy side, there. It was. It was pretty interesting. That's strong negatives. I think as a leader, he's a poor leader. I'm a CEO of a company, and the end of the day, the buck always stops with me. And the not assumption of responsibility was really Buckley bothersome. That is like, oh, it's not my fault. It's so and so's fault. And he would keep kind of blaming people on it. So on the leadership side, and just the disaster of his personal, you know, all the attention that took was catastrophic. Like, I just didn't. I didn't like that. I didn't. You know, it's very difficult for me to square those things of, like, how much attention. It's like, the president needs to be relatively vanilla, and you just move forward and don't mess up the country kind of situation. That's my stance. So those pros and cons, and there's a lot more to it, but I won't bore everybody with my. With my kind of opinions on both sides.

Kamala Harris and Law Enforcement

And then on Kamala Harris's sign, on the pros, I don't. I think, you know, from what I understand, she was relatively tough on crime in California. I'm not sure what that is, but, you know, I did see that she made some terrible decisions on incarcerating African Americans for a long period of time, for minor drug offenses, which is insane. And then she, like, I think, hid, you know, evidence for or obfuscated evidence for keeping people incarcerated for long periods of time. And I'm really concerned about the trans issue. The, you know, the, you know, this amplification of unresolved trauma is. Is extraordinarily dangerous. There's this victim perpetrator dynamic that's really concerning. So I can't really think a lot of pros on her side. I'm hoping that some. I want my goal is to have sane Democrats and sane Republicans argue. I think that's where the tension and the power of this country comes from is that you have progressives that move the ball forward and you have conservatives that make sure that the trains are running on time. And I want, you know, middle people to be struggling with those ideas, right. Like, you know, center left and center right, arguing about principles and move the country forward. That's kind of my point. But, you know, on through this exercise, faceless, what you said is like, I don't really have any pros for Kamala Harris. I do have some pros for Trump.

Reflecting on Trump's Leadership

But I just like on the leadership and accountability and pettiness side, especially the fact that I know people that have dealt with him and before his presidency, before he was famous. And he's just, I mean, it's just like from a, from a personal ethics perspective is just not somebody that I look up to. So I'm really struggling, man. I hate being in this position. This, this sucks. Yeah. My dad, I'm from New York City, and my dad had dealings to, you know, on, you know, both sides of the table with him. My dad was a litigator, and he was, when he was running the very first time in 2016, he was beside himself. Like, how, you know, how can the Republicans pick this person? And I didn't vote for him in 2016. I voted for the libertarian candidate for Johnson. But then he won. And I told people earlier, like, I gave him a chance. I said, all right, well, let's see what he's going to do. And of course, because I expected terrible things, I was, you know, pleasantly surprised. This isn't so bad. And that the tariffs were terrible, but, you know, the tariff stuff that he wanted to do, but as far as, which he still wants to do, but as far as some of his other things, I was like, okay, well, tax cuts, good, but he didn't cut spending.

Issues with Trump's Governance

That was a problem. And he spent a lot of money and didn't like that, you know, so it was a mixed bag, but it wasn't all bad. So I was, because I expected nothing. I was, like, pleasantly surprised. Then what I didn't like, similar to you was I didn't like how much attention was on him and all of this. He left so many people in place who were so obviously allied against him that I thought that was terrible management. To your point, who does that? Like, you know, these people hate your guts and they have it in for you. You get rid of them like, you don't leave them in place. You don't make, it's not conciliatory. It's not reaching across the aisle. It's just stupid. So that struck me as pretty dumb. And, of course, that we saw what happened and it took up a lot of time and money and attention when things were, we really needed somebody with their eye on the ball. So I had my issues with that coming into this time. I was like, I wasn't never Trump. Like, I had TD's, but I just said, yeah, no, I'm, I voted for him in 2020. He lost. And then the whole way that he handled the law, not January 6, I think that a lot was made out of that. That didn't, it didn't deserve what it got. But more the, after that, the legal stuff and everything.

Trump's Controversies

And the whole time, well, before the election, I was like, dude, now is the time you take legal action. What are you doing? What are you doing? Like, do something. And he didn't do anything, and he waits till after it's over. So, of course it looks like sore loser, right? And I just, I thought, that is just bad. Like, I'm not voting for him again. And that's where I've been, was just kind of like, forget it. I'm Alva Libertarian, et cetera. And then I guess I thought he was running against Biden. Not that I wanted Biden to be president again, but I had this kind of, I don't know what you want to call it, like resigned apathy, like, whatever. It's going to be. What's going to be. Let's just see if we can get the libertarian candidate up to 5% nationwide and, you know, send a message. It never dawned on me they would actually perpetrate this little coup. I really need to revise my shock levels to be different than they are because I'm way too easily shocked now and I shouldn't be. And then once they just kind of replaced Biden after lying and lying, and the media just went along with it, I was like, we're living in some weird new version of the Soviet Union, because I studied the Soviet Union back when I was in college that studied their politics, and these things are functioning very similarly to the way they work there.

The Current Political Climate

And I saw, and I saw it and I said, this is really kind of frightening, this whole machine thing. And then when she stepped in front of the microphone and so did all those other people and started talking about, when we believe this and we believe that and we're going to do this, we're going to do that. And billionaires, millionaires, we can take their money and they have too much. And, and then hearing the, and her float these policies but not commit to anything on paper. And I felt like we were in a slow rolling revolution like this. It's not coming. It's here. And we maybe just don't see it because they're doing such a great job of concealing it and disguising it and pretending it's not really happening. But I don't know that it's not already too late to save the republic. But I guess I'm looking at it now is I feel like if I don't do everything I possibly can to try to stop that or at least throw sand in the gears, then how am I going to face my kids? Will I regret it? Will I look back and regret it and say, oh, you and your principals, you wanted to make a point to whom? To whom? The people online with you in the grocery line to get your daily ration.

Concerns about Political Extremes

Like, what is your point now? And I started feeling like it was a little bit of a luxury belief that not voting wouldn't matter and that I could just stand on principle. I can stand on principle on all my local and state elections with ease. I don't know about this one. That's kind of where I'm at with it. I feel like I need to. And then when he took the strategic move to bring RFK on board or get his endorsement, yes, it's strategy, but that's mature, that he's matured since last time. You know, for those two to reconcile enough to shake hands and stand on the same stage, that's a little bit of growth for him, which shocked me. And then the other thing was, it's smart, you know, it's a smart deal, if you will. And on top of that, if he really is true to his word, which is a crapshoot, but let's say he is, that he cares about dealing with disease and the food supply and so forth, insofar as cracking down on corruption and fraud. I don't want coercive laws like forcing people to eat this or not eat that, but I definitely want the corruption, the fraud, the lies, the favoritism, the rent seeking, all these kind of things that I absolutely hate, that I do believe are going on in these federal agencies.

Hope for a Political Shift

I do want that dealt with. And I think RFK gets it on that front. And so that's why I think an alliance there gave me some hope that maybe a couple issues that really matter a lot to me might get more attention than they otherwise would have. And they won't get any attention on the Kamala side. Like, zero, because those are all her big donors. Those are the people that run the machine. And so I don't have this whole drain the swamp idea anymore. That's just not happening. But if we can throw sand in the gears and uncover some, at least just tell the american people the truth. If he did nothing else but one and got in there and allowed RFK to stand up in the bully pulpit or go in front of Congress and testify and say, I've uncovered this fraud and this waste and this graft and this that and the other, and the FDA and NIH and the CDC, and therefore our food supply is unsafe because they're using these agencies as money laundering schemes and power brokers, you know, departments. The american people would hear something when they.

Concerns About Food Safety and Awareness

I mean, that would expose it, and it really needs to be exposed. The journals, the journalists will still try to say they're crazy, cuckoo, blah, blah, blah, but it will still, we have a right once it's being testified in front of Congress. They cannot hide it the way they're hiding it now. They've done such a great job of censoring him and all the other doctors and all the other scientists that you talk to the average person in the street, do you know what the negative side effects of this or that are? Do you think this is safe or that is safe and the average person is. What are you talking about? This is a problem. Why I shouldn't feed this to my kids. They literally don't know. You can't make informed decisions for yourself, like, as we libertarians would like us to do. If you don't know somebody's willfully hiding the information from you, then how are you making your decisions? It's not your choice. Then it's someone else's choice. Hey, it's food. Perfectly fine. Eat it.

Awareness and Critical Thinking

Wait, it's microplastics. Why am I eating microplastics? I don't want to eat microplastics. You know, they should probably tell us. So that's kind of where I came down on it. If we just get more attention on these issues and on what's causing our kids to be so sick, that will be a good thing. But I don't have high hopes. But it's higher than it was. Anyway, anybody else have any thoughts? Yeah, could I respond to that real quick, please? Oh, yeah. You know, I keep getting this feeling that and not feeling. And I think it's more of a, there's a lot of evidence towards this, is that we're currently being leveraged for the extremes to destroy in some capacity of the country, right, or greatly weaken it.

Historical Context and Manipulation

And Yuri Bezmanov's, you know, strategy is a former KGB agent that came, you know, defected to the United States and talks about these four phases, or three phases, that is how you destabilize a powerful country like the United States. And, you know, I'm originally from Venezuela, and I saw this happen in Venezuela. First they took over the educational institutions, and then the educational institution started to seep into common life, right? And then the governmental institutions and set up this dynamic of this victim perpetrator, right? And that's what I think the danger of Marxism really is. It's a, is this victim perpetrator narrative, right? It's like the US versus them, the haves versus the have nots. And, and if we start dividing and this happens on both left and right. Both extreme fascism comes from this and also communism or social, and comes from the same, base formula or the base ingredients of this.

Reactions to Social Division

And I think what happens is there's, it ends up being, coming from unresolved trauma in social systems and cultural and social systems. And if enough people feel victimized, that victimization can be leveraged to create conflict. And I think, you know, I can't help but feel that there's external adversaries against the United States that understand this dynamic, that are actively leveraging this, right? And because we've gained so much mental real estate from the, you know, advancement of technology, that now the thing that's coming up, right, that we're not no longer trying to survive, right? In the 1920s and, you know, during the Great Depression, everybody was trying to survive. Then there was the baby boomers. Like, everybody was very prosperous. So we had, where everybody was industry. Everybody's very busy building things, right? And now that the workload has decreased so much, we've left this mental real estate open to have a fertile ground for manipulation and leveraging, right?

Addressing Manipulation and Healing

And so the only way that I know to get to outgrow being manipulated, right, or being triggered is to deal with your own internal demons and your own unresolved trauma, right? What I found is the more I work on my shit, the less susceptible I am to mental mind viruses, right? It's the inoculation of the soul in some capacity that I can no longer be manipulated. I can start seeing the force for the trees. I'm like, these are patterns that are happening over and over again. And it's just been through this deep work that I. That I've done to be able to say that. So, like, how do we educate people to be, like, work on your. So you're no longer manipulated. If you're left or right or up or down or pink or polka dot or whatever you are, don't have these extremist views where you see your opponent as the other, therefore creating a ground where you could dehumanize them and then justifies horrific acts against them.

The Role of Education

So why am I playing? No, I mean, I think you're right about that. Lady Lazarus, did you want to add to that or say something? Yeah, I mean, I think we've talked about this before. I think what's laid the groundwork for us to be so divided like this is not to just social media, which is full of echo chambers, but, it's more like the education system has kind of set us up to be this way. Like, it's. It's not a bug of the system that all of these things get, like, woke stuff gets put into the schools, and then we're fighting about that. Like you and I have talked about, the system was set up, like, with this prussian model. It's set up to get people to not think.

Vision for the Future

So if you're concerned about the fact that people don't have critical thinking skills, which I know, that's, like, maybe it's not critical thinking skills. Maybe it's active thinking skills. Maybe it's, you know, teaching your children have a bullshit detector, which is what I do with mine. But, like, if we're concerned about people being able to detect this and not to be divided into tribalism, there's only, like, there's only a couple answers to get us out of that. And, like. Like, Deb and I talk about all the time about education being the key to all of that. And, like, you know, it's really hard for people to think outside of those norms when it comes to politics because we're all kind of being herded that direction because we're set up to do what we're told in school. And unless you have a different.

Recognizing the Experiments of Liberty

Unless you've had a different, like, rearing, like, unless your parents have raised you to have the ability to sort through people, what people are telling you to believe and what you see online, you're not going to be able to do that. You're just going to go with the tribalism. You know, because that's what we're going to revert back to no matter what. This experiment we're in America is an experiment. It's true. That's true. And it is to be protected. It is normal for people to revert. It's a good word to say. Revert, or regress. What I would. I keep coming up against. Are there two fundamentally different ways of looking at what your role is in the world? Like, on the planet? One of them is, my goal is to be good. Not to be a good person, but to be good.