MARKET TALK/REVIEW #BITCOIN #MINERS #TECHNICAL #FUNDAMENTAL #TRADES

Space Summary

The Twitter Space MARKET TALK/REVIEW #BITCOIN #MINERS #TECHNICAL #FUNDAMENTAL #TRADES hosted by atradezcrypto. The MARKET TALK/REVIEW space delved into the intricate world of trading, encompassing Bitcoin, miners, technical analysis, and fundamental aspects. Participants gained insights on market dynamics, the role of psychological coaching, and the significance of blockchain expertise. Discussions revolved around staying updated on news, utilizing technical indicators, and leveraging fundamental analysis for informed trading decisions. The space highlighted the importance of miners in securing blockchain networks, while also addressing the integration of psychiatric practices in enhancing trading performance. Market charts and technical analysis tools were emphasized for identifying patterns and optimizing trade strategies in the dynamic trading landscape.

For more spaces, visit the Trading page.

Questions

Q: How does news and trends affect trading decisions?
A: Staying informed helps traders make well-informed decisions and adapt to market changes.

Q: What role do technical indicators play in trading?
A: Technical indicators provide insights into price movements and potential market trends.

Q: Why is understanding the fundamentals important for traders?
A: Fundamental analysis helps traders assess the intrinsic value of assets and long-term market trends.

Q: How does Bitcoin influence market dynamics?
A: Bitcoin plays a significant role in setting market trends and impacting other cryptocurrencies.

Q: Why is mental game coaching valuable for traders?
A: Psychological aspects affect decision-making; coaching helps manage emotions and improve performance.

Q: What is the significance of blockchain expertise in trading?
A: Understanding blockchain technologies is crucial for grasping the future of finance and trading.

Q: How do miners contribute to the cryptocurrency ecosystem?
A: Miners secure blockchain networks by validating transactions and ensuring network integrity.

Q: Can psychiatric practices be beneficial in trading?
A: Psychiatric methodologies can enhance decision-making skills and emotional management in trading.

Q: How do market charts assist traders?
A: Charts provide visual representations of market data to identify patterns and potential trade opportunities.

Q: Why is technical analysis important in trading?
A: Technical analysis tools help traders analyze price movements and make informed trading decisions.

Highlights

Time: 00:15:42
Market Trends and News Updates Discussions on the impact of current trends and news on trading strategies.

Time: 00:25:19
Technical Indicator Insights Exploring the use of technical indicators in analyzing market movements.

Time: 00:35:55
Fundamental Analysis in Trading Importance of fundamental analysis in understanding market dynamics.

Time: 00:45:30
Bitcoin's Market Influence Examining Bitcoin's role in shaping cryptocurrency market trends.

Time: 00:55:12
Psychological Aspects in Trading Addressing the impact of emotions and mental coaching on trading performance.

Time: 01:05:44
Blockchain Technology in Finance Insights into how blockchain technologies are revolutionizing financial markets.

Time: 01:15:30
Miners and Blockchain Security Understanding the crucial role of miners in supporting blockchain networks.

Time: 01:25:18
Psychiatric Practices in Trading Exploring the integration of psychiatric methodologies in trading decision-making.

Time: 01:35:50
Analyzing Market Charts Utilizing market charts to identify patterns and potential trade setups.

Time: 01:45:39
Technical Analysis Tools Discussion on the importance of technical analysis in making trading decisions.

Key Takeaways

• Importance of staying updated on market trends and news for informed trading decisions.
• Tips for assessing technical indicators and analyzing fundamental aspects in trading.
• Understanding the impact of Bitcoin on the market and mining activities.
• Strategies for maximizing gains and managing risks in cryptocurrency trading.
• The significance of psychological aspects and mental game coaching in trading.
• Expertise in blockchain technologies and their influence on financial markets.
• The role of miners in securing blockchain networks and supporting cryptocurrency transactions.
• Integrating psychiatric practices for improved decision-making in trading scenarios.
• Exploring the correlation between market charts and trading patterns.
• Applying technical analysis tools for identifying potential trade opportunities.

Behind the Mic

Introduction and Sunday Show

What's up, everyone? Hello? Hello? You guys able to hear me? Hey, what's up? That's good, brother. You know, I'm just chilling. Just getting ready for the latest fucking Sunday show on x. Are we gonna get rugged again with your boost mobile Internet? No, no, I got that premium, five tier Wi Fi coming to your live, baby. So we get the premium tier. Boost mobile. Premium tier boost mobile. Three out of five stars. We'll get the job done. But let's see, we got Dan. Let me give Dan. The mic was good. Dan was good. Bear. What'S up? What's up? The bears in town. I was worried about you. Didn't hear from you yesterday. I thought you died, bro, I was so. Bro, I was so hungover, I wanted to kill myself yesterday. It was really bad how hungover I was. Haven't felt like that in a long time. Yeah, it was the quietest it's ever. We're live Twitter.

Recovery and Market Outlook

I know, I know. I'm back, though. Came back with a vengeance today. What's good, Dan? How are you? I'm good. Good. It's a. It's a Sunday, and I'm kind of relaxed, so I don't know how intense I'm gonna be. So forgive me. Oh, it's all good. It's a nice, relaxing Sunday. Pretty pre Labor Day. I'm sure everyone's vibing. It's gonna be a good weekend. I think we're gonna get a good pop to the week on a lot of charts. And then, you know, from there, we'll see how the charts handle all the fud. Coming up, we got data coming out September 4 to 6th. That's kind of important. The jobless claims, you know, the debate the 10th from Harris Trump. We have the possible rate cuts on the 18th. So from the 10th to the 18th might be a week where we deal, where we might see some movement. But I think after that, man, we got the quad witching on the 20th. Got some volatility, man.

September Market Expectations

How are you feeling, Dan, about September? You know, September is typically a weak month. I think everybody knows that. So I'm unfortunately prepared for a bit of a drawdown, but it won't. It won't change my optimism for the group. Yeah, absolutely. And that's how I feel, you know, going into September, just preparing, if anything, I feel like it's a lot easier to handle this September volatility now then, you know, people talking about it in July, August, like, now we have October and November to look forward to. Where, you know, in July even August, it's kind of hard to see, you know, that, like, bull run. Catalyst starting, and I'm getting excited going into September. I feel like we're almost there. I hear you. What was good? Freedom. How you been, brother? What up, brother?

Discussion on Current Market Trends

I'm doing well. Kind of thinking the same way. Same way Dan and everybody else is. Just seeing what September brings. We've already been through quite the chaos over the past, at least in crypto, for the past six months. You know, what's another month if we get it? But we'll see. I'm kind of in the boat of, you know, some of this might be priced in just because everybody seems to be thinking the same thing. But who knows? You know, we could have. I think the average for September is usually about 5% drawdown. In bitcoin. We could get that, which would only bring us to what? Like 53, 55, 4k. Or we could get 5% green. It's just, you know, nobody really knows at the end of the day, right. So we'll see what we get. And either way, I'm looking forward to October, November, December, January.

Reflections on Recent Trends

So. My thing is. So on August 4 5th, we had that huge dip where it started. No, I feel you. I'm trying to think about the macro conditions that are different from now compared to, like, August 1, 2nd, 3rd, 4th that caused that huge downtrend. Like, do you guys think we're going to experience a downtrend like we did in the beginning of August, or do you guys think it'll be quicker? Like, what are you. What are you anticipating for this down move? You know, everyone, the seasonality and the conditions. Do you think? I think August 1 would have had more Fud news around it than anything that is September is going to bring. I feel like, you know, with the rate cuts are already more positive sentiment than bad, and I feel like the positive versus Fud is kind of even for September. We're, you know, going into August, we're ending the bitcoin conference. A huge sell off event.

Bear Season Market Insights

Like, I don't really see a huge sell off event like that leading up to, you know, this volatility that we're entering. But I'd love to hear some of your thoughts. It's the bear months, bro. We're going into bear season, right? September, October, November, December. Right? I mean, it's. It's telling you in the name, man. You're right. That's a funny one. When you look back at August, it was all about the end. That's what caused the sudden decline across all markets. And it doesn't look like that problem's really gone away. So it may seem like it's under control, but I think it's still there. The other thing that I find ironic about the optimism right now is the reason why people are talking about lower rates is because the economy may be soft.

Anticipated Market Actions

And now question becomes, is it softer than what people are thinking? And so I think the setup is for us to have a decline. But, but that doesn't necessarily mean you go short. It doesn't necessarily mean that you panic when it happens. It just means that you have to be prepared with some cash on the sideline or like in our case, sometimes, you know, we're looking at where we've got defensive positions. The funny is my funniest last comment, which I'll make, you know, just generally, about the miners and our overall portfolios. I operate under the assumption, not that I'm going to be right all the time, but how bad are things going to feel when I'm feeling wrong? And that's clearly a period of time right now. Right. We need to be prepared that we're going to feel wrong when prices go against us right now. And are we still confident in what we're long sorry for?

Long-Term Confidence Amidst Volatility

Yeah, like, no, no. I love that you bring that up and that all carries into, like, the sentiment going into, like, September. So with that being said, I, I feel very comfortable long term for short term. And I feel exactly like you're saying, brother, like, you know, the turbulence we're going to experience here is, going to be, I think, in my opinion, quick. It's going to be, you know, Max Payne maybe another month. And I'm interested to see how hard this bull run starts. Do you guys have any expectations for October then? Like, what are your expectations for October? We can hear anyone else if Dan doesn't want to chime in. Hey, lady Trader. Hey, Luca. Hey, Sebastian, Anthony, what's good? Hey, everyone.

Market Predictions for September and October

So I'll just put in my two cent on this. I think September is going to be like the last month. You can really get into a good position on these miners before we start ripping much higher into October, into November. And we might see a down month in December, but that's kind of what I'm seeing right now. So I want to buy as much as I can in this coming month. Yep. And even myself with my minor positions, I'm debating on just letting them ride, man. I don't feel like chasing or having to chase these lower prices going into October, when I know the turbulence and the volatility is like, basically at its peak. I mean, the risk versus reward for a lot of these miners, regardless of, you know, people are talking about.

Risks and Considerations in Mining Investments

Let's bring up Cleanspark, for example. There's this, not ATM or dilution. This, what are they doing? Increasing their shares, which is a little different than ATM, but this is the name of the game. Look at how, look at how the ATM dilution really affected Mara Corzie, BT or bit dear, all them, when they announced this ATM dilution. I feel like it's all part of the game. And, you know, in my opinion, I'm not too scared of Cleanspark going back down to like seven, $6. What is everyone's thoughts on Cleanspark right now and what they announced? Well, I think it's part of the game here. We've seen it with Riot. Riot increased their shares, I think, from 400 million to 800 million just this year. I believe if that hasn't already gone through, it probably will.

Cleanspark's Growth Strategy

So they need to do this if they want to continue to grow, expand by, you know, other assets, other miners, possibly, they're going to have to do that. But if you look at it over the long term for them, it's been accretive to investors, I believe, and that's the case that I'm going to be with for the time being, is whatever they're going to do is going to be accretive to the shares that I have and the potential for the company going forward. Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, just, this is a good fud burger to really get the downside, you know, with these guys moving, in my opinion. I think clean Spark is just looking at the charts and every single timeframe. I think clean Spark is pretty bottom freedom. What do you think? Or Luca, what are you guys seeing with the chart?

Technical Analysis and Market Sentiment

I mean, I just really can't imagine it going back into bear market territory, bear market numbers. And I'd be interested in curious to see how it holds up this first week. Any of you can chime in? Sure. I'll go. Yeah. So I am thinking as of now that the August 5 low holds for Cleanspark. That's my at least base case. But you never know. I mean, people tend to really overreact to news like this, and it has been not the strongest off the lows compared to, you know, your wolfs or BTBT or Coors. You know, obviously there's the HPC component with some of those, but even compared to, like, Mara, it's been weaker off the lows. But I do see, I think that nine, I believe it was like 930 or something on August 5.

Market Projections for Cleanspark

I think that's gonna hold. But if nothing. Yeah, it would open the door to, you know, seven, eight. But yeah, my personal and a lot of it depends on bitcoin obviously, if we're going to sweep the 49k lows as of now, I don't have that as my preferred count. I have it as you know, going into 53, 55, even as low as 51. But I'm basically having the August 5 low as my anchor low now if that gets swept then yeah, all the miners are going to sweep their August 5 lows too. Most likely. Besides maybe your coarse wolf BTBG hive that are up much higher away from their invalidation points. Yeah, no, I agree. Luca, what are you seeing on the charts in lady trader for Cleanspark? Just from a technical standpoint since.

Insights on Current Trends

And then we can dive into what news kind of shook everyone and we'll go dive into that. Hello. So I mean, Cleanspark really looks great in my opinion, on a high timeframe basis. I think it's great to accumulate no matter if it goes even lower short term. I personally did that. I increased my position by around three x since March as I think that the next run up will be incredible and I see no reason to panic over short term news. This might be even a capitulation announcement. In my opinion it's a nothing burger for a short term basis as they are not diluting, but they are opening up their possibility to dilute in the future, which of course miners do that as they don't have other ways to attract financing yet with the rates being high.

Technical Approach to Investment Strategies

But on the technical side, personally I'm looking more at the high timeframe basis as I said, and I'm looking to accumulate more. I'm holding a bit of cash right now to maybe look for some bids lower. I don't know if I will fill them even on bitcoin it touched my bid zone. But right now I think we are in a bottom formation and I don't think that is the right move to panic or to overthink short term price action. Yeah, and you know, that's my point right now as well. Being a swing trader with the miners, I'm entering those, you know, really thinking about if I want to continue swing trading them or not. And you know, I'm entering that point where I definitely don't feel comfortable going to see how this week opens up and then probably just let it ride.

Investment Considerations

Like I said, there's a lot more risk to reward up to the upside than downside here for my opinion. I mean, these are pre bull market prices. I mean, some of these prices are even cheaper than what they opened up in the beginning of the year. Sebastian, there's a question for you. He says, andy says, how was the last atm for clean spark been? What does it say, cured for shareholders? As today, the stock market under eleven. And that. And then time of the announcement was 24 72. I'm not sure what you mean by that, but that's a question for Sebastian. Well, I mean, the recent 18 that they've been pulling on, which was what, 800 some million? I believe it was they increased it or got another one for 800 million.

Cleanspark's Future Growth

They were able to get grid, which they're working on closing that they also bought sites in, where was it? Wyoming, Mississippi and things like that. So they're definitely growing towards their goal of getting to 32 ox. I believe this year, by the end, we'll see if they can get close to that. And then they still have machines on order to get into like 50 x a hash sometime early next year as well. So they still need to buy potentially more sites from that. So. And then as far as the timing, I mean, people are jumping on the timing again with the long weekend and then putting out this release that they're going to be increasing the shares amount that's available to them to dilute later on.

Market Reactions and Timing

Yeah, I mean, timing is going to be timing. You know, whether they do it over a three day weekend or if they do it over a regular two day weekend, people are going to be pissed off about it one way or another. So I don't think that matters at all. The only thing is, can they continue to execute like they have in the past and can they grow even further than the 50 x a hash they have announced for so far? Yeah, no, good point. I think if there's one company, one miner, that I'm not too scared with dilution or how they handle their delusions, it's clean spark. They've already shown to effectively hit the goals and execute as appropriately.

Execution and Future Strategies

I think personally they bought a small jet. I think they should have went a little bigger. Honestly. If anyone deserves a big jet is the Cleanspar boys. Yeah, I mean, if you look at their, where they started just back in 2021, at the beginning of the year, January, they had a 100 PETA hash. What are they at now? 21 exahash or something like that. Within three years, roughly three and a half years or so. I mean they've come out of nowhere, beat the pants off of a lot of these guys have been in the business for a long time and they've grown to be what, the second biggest as far as market cap is concerned after a marathon right now. I know, I think core is kind of nipping at their heels a little bit there, but that's a tremendous job done by the team there.

Market Outlook and Future Investments

You know, you can't take that away from them. What are your thoughts, bitcoin mining guy Anthony? I'd love to see what you guys feel about this. I know you're just a mega perma bull. So no, unfazed by the news. So what's the specific question? How do I feel about clean spark? How do you feel about this share increasing? You know, people with the seat? Basically what the CEO posted in his tweet kind of explained the situation. I don't think it's fair just to say dilution. I think what it's more helpful for the audience to understand, you know, what they're actually doing.

Understanding Dilution Amid Growth

Right. So they have demonstrated that they are great operational miners, right. They're really good at deploying exahash and growing really quickly, which is important, especially in a bull market. And they've become one of the top miners, like you said, out of nowhere. So they've demonstrated that their growth has been accretive so far. And as long as they keep hitting their targets and they don't slip, I think they can be good stewards of capital. And this authorized share thing is not a dilutive event. But you know, the bears are actually right. I mean this is an industry where that is the way to do it. Right. But it's only going to be accretive if they keep up that momentum.

Cleanspark's Competitive Advantages

The challenge is Cleanspark has said this, that they're sticking to being a pure play miner. And the risks associated with that could be that. What if the market just prefers or the hybrid model where cleanspark may be in a position where they might not be able to raise capitalized easy as they could in the past? That's a challenge. Right. And that's one of the key competitive advantages of being a public company and a great miner. But I'm both on cleanspore. I think they're one of the best miners and they could flip marathon just because they're really good operators.

Future Potential and Concerns

But you know, I'm not going to be surprised if at some point they're a $20 billion company, but they're going to be needing a ton of capital. Billions and billions of dollars. Right. We've seen many hundred million, hundreds of millions of dollars raised for the purpose of growth. We've seen the stock go from $2 to almost $25 and it ran way past its fundamentals. And that's what you see in a bull market. Right. I think we'll see a couple of the miners raise over a billion dollars from today for the next phase of growth. That's going to hurt the market. And we're going to start seeing even more volatility just like we're seeing today.

Current Market Sentiments

Stocks are down over 50% right now. People are worried. People are fearful. And it's kind of funny to me. This is one of the best miners, period. Just a few quarters ago, this was the number one company everyone wanted to be a part of. And now they're even bigger in terms of their infrastructure. And people are worried because they're down 50%. I mean, they have a good reason. They bought the top and they're seeing the price of bitcoin go down. They're worried about September. So I think there's going to be more capitulation on the retail side that just doesn't understand what they own.

Long-Term Strategy and Outlook

And in the long run, I think Cleanspark is set up for success for the next bear market and the next bull market. And if they're $20 billion company, I'll be fine. If they buy a $50 million jet, no worries. Right. But that process between now and four years from now is going to be very painful. Right. Most people, most retail are going to get hurt. Right. Because they don't understand what they own. Right. And they're going to pay per hand. And then you have people like me that they're just going to be buying these dips and benefiting.

Future Prospects in Mining

It's very clear to me that they're top operators and they know how to raise capital and use that productively and accretively for the benefit of long term shareholders. But the short term speculators and traders that really don't understand what's going on, those are the people that are going to get hurt. Yeah. I'd like to share this chart real quick that bear put up. So bear, you think the gap, you think we gap it down to five, $6? Yeah, I mean, this is just my personal trade style, but it's kind of how I look at these charts. I'll find the zones and then I'll try and find kind of the channel that represents or best represents the current volatility range and so this is how I'd be trading that.

Trading Strategies and Market Sentiment

This is how I'm looking at it right now is. I think there's a lot of confluence for a move to set up like that. You know, I'm having just a hard time picturing it drop that low just based off of the, you know, the sentiment. I think a lot of the price is already priced in, like freedom is saying. And I think, you know, fishing for those numbers. I think it's even gonna be hard for this thing to really stay under, you know, where it previously dipped. Like, even the $8 range is gonna be extremely hard for this thing to stay down, in my opinion. Like, the gap to the downside from nine to, like, 750. I would be super curious to see if we even get to there.

Market Dynamics and Trends

I mean, in my opinion, the daily is bouncing kind of consolidating above this $10.50 range. And I guess the big thing here to take into consideration is how the market opens up honestly this week. But what's good, I just would remind. Everybody, just because they're increasing their ability to add to the number of shares doesn't necessarily mean that they print those shares at $6 or $10 for that matter. Right. They don't have to do that. So my experience with Cleanspark is they've been pretty careful about when they lean in on the stock.

Investment Strategy Considerations

And I think most everybody has to consider, do they want to own a smaller piece of a larger pie or the opposite, in which case, you know, a larger piece of a smaller pie that we know ultimately will be just shrinking and have to be sold outright as a company because they won't be able to grow if they don't have access to capital. Yeah, no, I love that you highlighted on that. Thank you for touching base on that. What's good, Andy? Mining guy. So we already talking about next bowl cycle, right? So are you suggesting that everybody should just round trip again this cycle like you did last cycle?

Discussion on Market Cycles and Strategies

So. Like, so. So I don't think. No fighting, Andy. No fighting. No fighting, G. But I don't think that's a appropriate question, G. Because, I mean, a lot of people I wouldn't consider a round trip. And g, I. I mean, the conviction. Up he go. Okay, never mind. What was he even saying on that? The round tripping, but whatever. I don't think. I don't think. Oh. Oh, dang. Okay, we'll carry this on. What, about, clean spark, though, Dan? I think that's a good point.

Understanding Dilution

So what's the difference between dilution and, what cleanspark is doing right now, because I would love for an explanation on that, if one of you can touch base on it. Hi, trade. They're just raising the authorized share capsule.

Discussion on Cleanspark's Share Increase

So they're saying that now it was at 300 million, they're going up to 600 million. And what it means is when they put their order in for the next atm, they have sufficient shares available to then start selling. So it just gives them authorized, an authorized total. So they're not diluting at the moment, but it effectively just gives them the ability to dilute sometime in the future up to effectively another 300 million shares. And what they've got at the moment, I've got a concern about it. I think we all agree that there's not many other options. They can sell the bitcoin, they can try and get debt, but debt won't be cheap for a pure play bitcoin miner because the markets aren't really interested in bitcoin mining at the moment as opposed to HPC.

Concerns About Announcements Timing

So the ATM is probably the route forward. They've used it really well. No one can disagree with that. My only concern is really timing of some of these announcements. I mean, were, you know, quite a few on this call now are on that spaces meeting back in March when they're. When they made the announcement, a public holiday, about the 800 million ATM and the selling of the shares the day before. And it's another announcement with the public holiday, although it's not public holiday in UK tomorrow, but it's a public holiday in North America. So just the timeliness of some of these announcements could better done.

Concerns Over Bitcoin Mining Expenditures

So, you know, communications team there at Cleanspot need to work on that a little bit. I don't agree with bitcoin mining going on the jet there, but, you know, I mean, these mining companies don't need jets. They can. They can travel. Yeah, I said it tongue and cheek. Yeah, they can travel business and first class and get to all these locations that they do to equally as well and save the company a lot of money. Those three shareholders, the three big shareholders in Cleanspark, the chairman, CEO and the CFO, they sold $40 million of shares in March. Why don't they buy themselves a jet between them with the proceeds they made from selling the shares? And that was only a small percentage of their holdings. So if they want to do that, you'd be extravagant that way.

Debate on Mining Company Strategies

But this is effectively shareholders funds in the company that I'm not in total agreement with it. I think it's just a waste. If they're trying to raise money to buy more facilities, grow hash rate, then that's what they're there to do. I think that's just another distraction, another mistake. And we don't need it because they are, they're a good operator. They've proven to be. Bear in mind, they've only been going around in bitcoin mining times just over three years. So it's not like that they're long in this industry. Most of the mining companies are old and cleanspot, but they use the ATM really well and other people are now iron have used that formula and managed to use it well to get to their growth targets.

Evaluating Mining Debt and Capital Raising

And I mean, Mara and Wright were the two initial ones that were able to fully utilize it to grow really quickly on the Nasdaq. But for those sort of top 910 miners, all sort of hovering around a billion plus in market, captain, you know, you're going to grow and you want to grow by, you know, by the cheapest means. And, you know, in 2022, we saw all these miners take out loans. It became a real problem. We're not seeing that now to a certain extent. We've seen some of the big miners take out these notes, but the percentage rates for these notes is quite low. I think Mara was two and a quarter and core scientific was 3%. That's cheap debt.

Loan Problem Scenarios

I. Some of these miners were paying 1819, 20% on their loans in 2022. That's where it became a problem. Even the likes of bit farms were paying 18, 19% on some of their loans in 2022 and realized it was aspiring out of control. And then at the right moment in time, they just turned around and said, we've got to get rid of this debt. And they did everything, sold everything they had. They were selling miners in boxes that had just been delivered back onto the market to reduce that debt. And they did it over about 20 month period. So learning from that, you've got to look at other options to raise capital.

Cleanspark's Increase Authorization

So I don't disagree with Cleanspark authorizing this increase. And they effectively did it internally. So they issued a load of preference shares, I think, to one of the directors and is able to vote those that, that actual vote it through without having to go through effectively ask shareholders to decide on it. So. But shareholders will have an impact on whether the future ATM's are approved. But that's, this has already been approved now by the company. So this was approved last week, apparently from what Matthew put in his tweet.

Peer Plays and Institutional Clients

What'S good, mining guy? I was thinking some of the peer plays might reconsider or consider hosting. Like not HPC hosting, but hosting. Other institutional clients get into mining, right? I mean, they could use it to, you know, institutions can buy the stock, or they could also just clients and say, hey, look, I've got $50 million, $100 million. I want to work with the top mining company that has the best operations and knows how to mine very well. You know, I think there's a market for that, and the benefit is that there's a margin associated with that, and they could use that margin, they could use that cash flow from business to grow their company.

Concerns Regarding Hosting Services

And that's a non dilutive way of growing the company. I haven't received many responses yet, but I tagged a couple of the companies, but I could see some of them that just refused to get into AIHPC to look for ways to grow more sustainably, I think. You think if you can raise capital to grow organically, your own hash rate, you won't be hosting others. Hosting over the last few years has not been a great business for most of the miners. So even some of miners we don't talk about hot had a hosting business.

Host Companies and Energy Prices

Bit Farms had a hosting business. Hive had a hosting business. They don't does now with USBTC, but Hut had given up its hosting business before it merged. The ones that do okay, Bitdid does okay, you know, very much margin orientated bitfufu as well. Sorry, I don't know if you cover foo, but bitmain. No, I don't cover foo, but, you know, unless you've got an extremely low energy price. And when I say low, it needs to be the sort of like three cents a kilowatt hour, because anything above that at the bitcoin price at the moment, you're just not going to get people, your host customers will be paying more than they're going to get back in terms of the rewards and the transactions and rewards that are on stake at the moment.

Challenges of Hosting in Current Market

Hash price is so low, it's just not making it practical for bitcoin. Miners are just about breaking even. Hosting is going to be a nightmare at the moment. Hosting will be good in a sort of a bear cycle where you want sort of like if you're the host company and you've got really strong clients with great liquidity who can afford to pay you during the downturn and pay you every month, then that's a good revenue stream in a bear cycle. But in a bull cycle, you want to increase your own hash rate.

Current State of Miners and outsourcing

We've seen riot get rid of all their hosting business in the last six to twelve months. You know, it's problematic. It really is. It's problematic because you sign up contracts with host companies, you've got to agree energy prices. And, you know, we found some companies like Celsius Wright had problems, hut had problems in Canada where, you know, the increase in energy cost causes a problem where companies. Well, I can't afford to pay that now. But you're contracted to pay. Well, yeah, I'm contracted, but I just can't afford it. It becomes a problem.

Potential Hosting Considerations

So unless your clients really got great liquidity and can manage through a sort of like a period where there's not as much rewards coming through, then maybe that's something. But I don't see cleanspark looking at a hosting model. I see cleanspark marathon riotous growing their hash rate as quickly as practical. Right, but that's during the bull market. I'm talking, how do we get to 2028? How do we get to 2030? How do we get to 200 exahash? 300 x 400 x a hash? 500 x a hash? There's going to be periods where there's bear markets and these companies have built strong brands and, you know, 50% of the shareholders are institutions, right?

Market Projections and Institutional Influence

So I think there is a market there for high quality. I'm not talking about retail, I'm not talking about, you know, you and I calling up Cleanspark and saying, can I buy ten miners? I'm talking about those that want to really, you know, want the economics, right. And can, and also, you know, the company has to deal with these clients, right? So they don't want to deal with this, you know, a smaller type of. I mean, you heard the news this week, didn't you mind, guy, that rhodium went bankrupt this week.

Rhodium's Bankruptcy Impact

So rhodium had three. Three exahash at Rockdale previously. Three X is three x. Ash is bigger than bit digital. It's like nearly more than half the size of hive digital. These are, that's not a small miner, that's a big customer and they've just gone bankrupt. Yeah, I don't know the details of how they manage their cash. Right. I mean it's a challenge for, it's a challenge for these miners at the moment, never mind those that have posted, you know, it really. No, no miner in the last quarter made a net profit.

Mining Sector Earnings Overview

Everyone was a net loss, you know. Yes, they, most of them were cash flow positive, just about. But this is mining. This isn't hosting. This is mining. But I'm not talking about today, right? I'm talking about when the bull run actually starts. Everyone wants to mine bitcoin, right? And I think that's the best marketing. The price of bitcoin. When bitcoin is 100,000, 80,000, everyone wants to be a bitcoin miner, right? And I think that's a really good time to start marketing these hosting services for the future.

Bear Markets and Industry Conditions

Right? I'm not saying to do it right now when even self mining is bad. I'm talking about, you know, sometime in the future. Well, historically, what we've seen is the miners that actually can't raise capital for whatever reason, are the ones that go into hosting. We saw with Mawson after the 2021 downturn into 2022, they had financial issues. I mean, they're still running. I don't even know if they're running the old machines. I mean, they got like some machines in there that were like 80 terrahash, 70 some terrahash.

Challenges Faced by Mining Companies

And they've pivoted more into hosting, partnering with people. We saw the same thing with Soluna as well. So it's instances like that is where you see hosting being attractive to those types of companies. But companies like Cleanspark, Marathon and Riot, there's reasons why Riot got out of the hosting business. They do not want to be a part of it. They want to be self mining. They'll use that ATM. They'll grow. They can also use the bitcoin that they have right now, sell it towards the peak if they're smart, use that billion dollars plus they're going to get for it and build out in the bear market and without even having to worry about hosting customers.

Considerations for Shareholders

Right, I agree with that. But also think about shareholders as well. Right. If there are opportunities where shareholders can not get diluted as much, right. And these companies can still deploy, they could still have the same goal for their self mining business. Right. This would just be ancillary business and it might not even work because they might not be able to attract the clients that they want. Right. But I think it might be worth looking into just to see if there's demand from the institutional side.

Identifying Potential Hosting Opportunities

And I think if they hit it right, they could attract the right clients and it could, you know, be less dilutive for shareholders. Well, we've got Dan Roberts on Tuesday on the podcast. So I'll put that question to him and see what he comes out with. I guarantee you he'll turn around and say they'll want every bit of capital that they're putting into their sites to be delivering either self mining or HPC. Right.

Future of Hosting in the Mining Sector

But he's hosting, I hear what you say, and hosting for a company like maybe Saluna, who was like Sebastian said, they can't raise capital so they have to look at margin businesses. Maybe someone like griffin mining. We've got, actually got Sheldon Bennett from DMG on the podcast this week as well. So that's a miner with between one and 1.7 x ash at the moment, depending on what the update this month. They used to be in the hosting business themselves and they're not hosting anymore at the moment.

Evaluation of Hosting and Mining Operations

But is that something that would appeal to them in terms of they can't grow quickly like some of the other miners, but those, the big miners, absolutely zero chance. You want to get the best return if you're building facilities and you've got power, you want the best return on that facility if you've got the capital. And these big miners, these 910 big miners now because there's a real split between them and then you've got the likes of Hive and bit digital trying to join that group, but finding it challenging because they can't raise capital like the ones above them.

Hosting Considerations for Smaller Miners

They won't be going through the hosting process. Seriously not. But some of the smaller miners, absolutely, because it's a way of getting a slim margin. Saloon only paid about three cents a kilowatt hour for their energy, so they can still charge a nice margin to a hosting client and both parties probably still do quite well out of it. But there's no way in this world that marathon, riot and Cleanspar are going to use any of their facilities.

Facilities Accessibility

The bottleneck at the moment is finding these facilities. Look what cleanspark are trying to do at the moment. They're trying to buy miners, they're trying to find facilities. They've got to grow to 32 by the end of the year, 50 by next year. Marathon have got to get by 50 by the end of this year. We haven't heard any updates from them in terms of where they're going to increase that hash rate. You know, riot 36 this year and God knows, 55, 56 next year, whatever, and even more down the pipeline. But nothing about hosting for the big miners.

Map of Miners' Immediate Goals

They just want to, they want to grow as much of their own hashrate. The margins are so much better. You know, we used to look at hosting as something like about 20% of what you could do if you were mining yourself. So 100%, you know, yourself. But if you're hosting about 20% of the profit you could achieve if you were self mining. So yes, it appeals to smaller miners. And bitdir have got, you know, hosting in theirs and they, from what I speak to them on the podcast, it is quite possible for them, but nothing, it's not massively profitable.

Profit Margins and Future Growth

It keeps the wheels going round. But Zach and, you know, and Jason and Fred will not be considering hosting one bit, that they'll just want to grow as quickly and as, you know, to get global, their share of the global hashrate. And if that's 510 percent of the global hashrate share, then that's what their target needs to be. And they'll want to keep increasing, increase and increase. And it's just like a yemenite, it's like a hamster wheel. As soon as the next target we talked about, end of this year's target got 2025.

Continuous Industry Strategy Maintenance

These miners now are using ATM's to pay for 2025 because most of them have got pretty much their cash required to get to the end of the year. So they're raising money for the next year now. And when we get to 2025, it'll be 2026. So it's just an ongoing sort of hamster wheel. And just hopefully the bitcoin price gets to a position where the shareholders who bought the shares originally sort of like, starts to see that benefit again.

Shareholder Expectations in the Market

Yeah. For me, if Cleanspark or if I own marathon or ride shares, if they came out saying that they're going to be hosting, that would be a time for me to sell everything that I go in those companies. I mean, time will tell with regards to those three if they'll ever consider going in down the HPC route. You know, we need that second deal to come out. You know, we can't just keep relying on call scientific being the only manager to get a significant deal from a HPC hosting contract.

Future Outlook on HPC Contracts

There needs to be another one, whether it's terror wolf or cipherte, who's going to be the next one to announce. But we need another announcement. And what that might do is it might equally shake up the market a bit further then and say, actually, this is more real than we thought, but we've only got the one sort of like, big deal on the table at the moment. We need that next one just to make sure it's not a one off.

Market Competitiveness Assessment

How many other companies are so. Well, I guess cash infused like core weave was. I mean, I don't think there's that many other AI companies out there. The other ones that are the hyperscalers. I mean, you saw Amazon reports they spent what, 34 billion this year alone on upgrading their infrastructure, their servers, and getting into AI. They're spending another like 30 billion this year. I mean, you can't compete with those guys, it seems like.

Uncertainty in Market Scale and Upgrades

So I'm still on the fence on it. If there's gonna be another one that's gonna be as big as core weave. Yeah. Hi, Penny. I just want to step in about the hosting discussion. I think hosting is actually not that terrible of a business. If you think about. If you look at the profits on a per kilowatt hour basis of mining versus hosting, mining has more volatility.

Profit Comparisons in Mining vs. Hosting

But if you figure you have to pay roughly, it's around three cents a kilowatt hour just for the Asics. If you want to upgrade them, call it every three years. On top of that, you pay the power prices. So you're looking at, I don't know, between eight and $0.09 plus your SG and a. So you're paying eight. Did a post a while back showing the revenues you can get per kilowatt hour for all the different generations of Asics.

Exploring Revenue Projections

And the sort of long term trend is it's not too far. Over ten cents a kilowatt hour in revenue. Some of them ended up pulling in a lot more like s nine s because it was right before a huge bitcoin rally. But overall, you might be able to expect like three, call it like two, to in profit from this whole ASIc thing where you constantly, or you refresh your fleet every three years or so, versus, you know, hosting, you can just sell off some.

Revenue and Profit Stability in Hosting

You charge the customer the cost of power, plus you take like $0.03 or something. So you're guaranteed like a flat three cents kilowatt hour profit versus this volatile thing, depending how this, how bitcoin goes when you, right after you buy your asics. So it's not that bad of a trade off. I think the reason that companies don't want to do it is because the investors are demanding their own self mining exahash growth.

Investor Expectations and Mining Strategies

So if you can dump 50 your hosting clients and fill it up with your own hash rate and claim that you have a quarter over quarter year, over year, whatever your new fleet is bigger, you're going to be able to raise more money and grow faster and grow bigger. Whether or not you're going to see like better cash flow than if you went hosting. I think that's secondary to the goals of many of the miners, which is just to get as big as possible, kind of secure their place in the public markets.

Concerns Over Hosting Models

So that's the reason I don't think, I think they don't want to go the hosting route. It's not because the cash flows are so terrible like hosting Asics right now is you could probably buy an ASIC and, excuse me, buy an ASiC and host it and you will on a per exa hash on a hash cost basis be like pretty much par with a lot of the pubcos. Some of them pay more than you would if you just hosted.

Nature of Competitive Mining Operations

But theyre after the capital that comes with having their self mining hash rate increase. So thats why I think they wont do hosting. Yeah these are fair points. So I was talking to the CEO of private company and theyre in the hosting business and hes one of the pioneers of mining companies called Blockware and basically CEO, I asked him, I was like what do you think the percentage of the network is actually hosted?

Insights on Market Hosting Statistics

And he said 40% which I was really surprised to hear and I had no idea. I don't know how accurate that number is but I was really surprised hearing that number. And after seeing bit deer and their margins from hosting, I was like, this seems pretty good, why aren't more people talking about it? Especially if every retail investor on Twitter is worried about dilution.

Market Response to Hosting Opportunities

The whole clean spark thing, that was overblown. But dilution is still going to be coming. There's no surprise there. If there's ways to dilute less while investing in self mining, I think the ends will justify the means and it could be the right move for certain companies. I think it's a responsible move. But I think right now the markets are kind of.

Current Market Dynamics

Yeah, I mean that's what everyone's saying. The market wants maximum exposure to the upside of bitcoin right now and they're willing to pay like a huge premium for it. And the companies are aware of this and you know, as much as people trash on the ATM's or whatever, like theyre dumping shares and those shares are getting bought and its sort of the flywheel.

Continuous Cycle of Investment

Dump the shares, get the cash, buy more x hash a second, you know, have bigger numbers of your exahash in the future, you have more exposure to bitcoin and then you repeat the process. I think as soon as the market actually cares about cash flows and wants to get more realistic about this and understand that the ASIC hamster wheel is theres a lot of decay in there and when you buy your asics then I think that hosting cash flows will come back into fashion.

Future Host Service Viability

Yeah, yeah. Aka the bear market. So it's just something to think about, right. I mean there these companies, these stocks all run past their fundamentals during bull cycles and when you have a huge premium on your stock that's the best time to raise money. Right. I mean I don't blame them for doing that. I mean it's just, it's free money right.

Analysis of Market Timing

And they know how to invest it to get a solid ROI. But I'm just thinking like bear market. Not that I'm saying bear markets and happen tomorrow but just thinking a few years down the line. So are we in a bull market right now? I know you think we are but if you look at the revenues of mining it's not that great.

Market Sentiment vs Financial Performance

Like S 21 is pulling in ten cents a kilowatt hour just in revenue so you can take out the cost of power and the SG and A. And it's like, you know it's not that much. So I guess like the sentiment is bullish but the actual numbers of mining right now are probably the most bearish they've been in a while. I think we're in a bull market.

Bullish vs Bearish Market Perspectives

I'm bullish. I think you hit it right there. It's the SGNA is a thing that is the key point. But SG and a also depends on the scale that you have. If you have a smaller miner that has a huge overhead with the SG and a because they're not at scale yet. Yes, that is going to be a drag on the stock.

Stock Performance Influences

But if you have a company that's reaching for and getting to scale, that SG and A is going to go up a little bit because you're going to need more people in there. But overall the scale is going to be the benefit of them actually getting better returns on it. You're going to be generating more revenue for the same amount of people that you have more or less.

Scale and Revenue Generation Challenges

You really need those miners to get to scale I think. And then in terms of September is a bearish month for just historically. What I think is going to happen are just the undervalued companies that actually have cash flow and solid margins from the HPC side. I think they're going to start getting some.

Valuing the Future Potential of HPC

I think they're going to be. They might go up this month like the core scientifics, the bit digitals and undervalued self miners like Hive. Right. I think we might see some of the pure plays take a hit this month if bitcoin just dumps and that capital can move to the more value type plays that have more diversified or just purely undervalued based on their exahash.

Investor Behavior and Stock Valuations

And then touch base real quick on if we're in a bull market, I would say yes, Penny, just because a sector like the miners aren't, we have to look at the indexes as like a whole. And, you know, Nasdaq is pretty all time high. Dow all time high. Spy all time high. Qqq.

Broad Market Trends and Implications for Miners

So when you see the whole market and as a whole moving like this, I would say, yeah, we're in a bull market. And, you know, unfortunately, these high risk assets within like the Nasdaq are obviously not moving like the rest of the Nasdaq or other assets in there. You know, it's probably just because of the nature of what they are and the attachment they have to bitcoin.

Recap on Host Strategies and Dynamics

All right, cool. Well, I got a run, guys. I just want to, I just had a couple minutes to hop in. I heard about hosting. Take care. Yes, sir. What's good, lady Trader, how are you doing today? Hey, doing great. Doing great. Thank you so much for having me up here today.

Bitcoin Historical Returns Analysis

I actually shared a quick post earlier. I pinned it. It just shows historical monthly returns for bitcoin. So you could actually go back pretty far on this one as far as 2011. And you can see what the monthly return looked like because I know a lot of people are wondering what September is going to bring.

September's Impact on Bitcoin

So it does have a few months of halving years actually that where September was green, 2012 was one. Of course, 2016 was also green and then 2020 was actually red. So we will just have to see how this September plays out. But my goodness, we are looking pretty bearish on some of these miners and then also on bitcoin.

Market Sentiment Regarding Bitcoin's Future

So. But hopefully it's going to bottom out here pretty soon. Yeah, that's a. I was going over like ta in a live stream, just being real, you know, just the monthly doesn't look good. Two week doesn't look good on bitcoin. Weekly doesn't look good. Just, you know, when all these bigger timeframes start to not look good, you just know that something bad is cooking or coming.

Technical Analysis Considerations

Yeah, daily. 800 EMA, I think could be something that we could see. That's what I'm, I definitely, I've been watching that for a long time, so we'll see if that happens. But, yeah, good times ahead after that, hopefully. I do need to run, though. I just wanted to come in and. Hang out with you guys for a little bit today.

Final Thoughts Before Departure

I know it's the Labor Day weekend. As well, so I hope everybody's having some fun. Yeah. Thank you for popping in. But back to the minor sector, I think, you know, it's crazy on the charts. You can tell the ones that are closer to the bottom or the bottom of the move, and the ones that, in my opinion, still have some wiggle room to come down, I guess, you know, the ones that concern me from, like, a technical standpoint would be quite.

Analysis of Key Miners

And Wolf. But these are obviously the strongest miners, fundamentally. So what do you guys. How are you guys feeling about them? Wolf is not a strong miner right now. I mean, they have low cost mine. Their stock price has run past its mining fundamentals. And there's hype right now that they're, you know, working with the hyperscaler. And if that's true, that's extremely bullish.

Current Developments and Future Prospects

I just need to see the revenues. A lot of these companies claim that they're in the HPC business, but they don't have any clients that are committed. But they do have great assets, like power assets that I believe that are mispriced, and there's a strong market. Wolf, I think, is one of them that might take hithenne core scientific. On the other hand, they have that. That core weave deal, right?

Market Insights and Strategic Shifts

So I think core scientific will actually benefit from the other sectors. The other miners not doing so hot this month, potentially. Yeah. I'm, like I said, interested to grab them for a little bit cheaper. I'm a buyer at $3. We'll see if they get it.

Bitcoin Miners and Market Sentiments

Beer? I'm not sure. If you look at a bitcoin miners. Right now, I'm looking at terrible fright. Yeah. Yeah, dude, I think you might get your. I think you're gonna get your entry. Yeah. I'm just being patient with it. So, when you look at this chart, like, terrible thing comparison to, like, a clean spark and, like, a morrow, wouldn't you agree that there's a lot more room for a downside hard move on Tara wolf compared to, like, a clean spark? So when you're looking and giving those targets for clean spark, in my opinion, clean sparks charts pretty bottom. And I can't imagine it, like, just going a lot lower where I could still see, you know, Tara wolf coming down significantly from here. Like, what's the worst case that you would say for Tara Wolf based on.

Evaluating Tara Wolf and Clean Spark Predictions

Like, what you're seeing? So, for Tara Wolf, I'm seeing 1 second pointer percentage wise. They're not that. I mean, they're kind of similar. What do you think? A 30% drawdown? A. Yeah, that's kind of what I'm. Seeing actually on a lot of see like 275 to like $3. Yeah, I'd be a big buyer if that happened. I'm not a te guy by any means. I just, you know, look at the fundamentals. Clean spark is at a low. I mean, it's hard to see it go lower. I think it could just based on the fud that was with the whole authorized shares thing, I don't think, I think that could cause stock price to temporarily go down. But I think Cleansbark is a great buy at these levels and it's just a great company in general. Same with Wolf. I just think Wolf has in the short period has slightly ran past its fundamentals based on where their company is today.

Fundamental Analysis of Market Dynamics

Yeah, no, I agree. I mean, I'm a buyer. I think like I said, in my opinion, the chart for it to go much lower is going to take a lot like that. Five, $6. I personally don't see it, but we'll see what's good. T surfden. Hey, how are you doing? Good, brother. How are you? Yes, sir. Just wanted to talk a little bit about bid deer with Anthony. I think that the sentiment around self mining and hosting is pretty much making bid deer looks bad. And I think I have to agree with Penny ether about the margins. And when you take a look about Q two earnings of bidder, you can see that they were the. I think they lost the list. They lost the list of all the miners maybe, except Wolf. Wolf lost 11 million bid year, 17 million and the rest lost 30, 4200 or 800 million.

Challenges in Hosting Business and Market Position

And they lost so little with their hosting business. So I figured that if the margins on the hosting business were that bad, they would probably lose at least like cypher or bit farms or I don't know. And it looks pretty good. And besides that, all of the chips they design and the 2.5 gigawatts they have under pipeline and they worth under $1 billion. It's less than 1 million in today's prices. We know that the HPC industry gets something like 30 million. They like I think 300. Now the question wasn't about whether bit was undervalued, question was about freedom talking. Thanks for that, brother. Can't tell because this might sound you. There's just a few questions real quick. Looks like someone says they know me. And freedom have conflicting opinions on the dollar. Can you please mention that, please, and let us know what you think.

Implications of Dollar Valuation on Market

Well, I personally think the dollar is going to start a little uptrend from here. From the weekly looks pretty bottom. From the, from the daily perspective it looks pretty bottom. So in my opinion, I think the dollar is going to go on a run leading into September, which would make sense on why probably a lot of assets are not going to be performing good dollars been on a downtrend trend, which probably explains this little run the markets have been doing all across. It'll be interesting to see how they handle that. So that's how I see the dollar playing out. And then this is probably a question for Sebastian. How do we look at justifying the valuation for these miners that are trading at billions when they're bringing in tens of millions?

Market Dynamics and Future Forecast

So that's a good fundamental question for Anthony and Sebastian. So I guess I'll stay with that. It's based on future potential, I guess you could say. Oh, you can't hear me. Yeah, he's talking. I'll be back. So let me drop down. I'll drop back in. Anthony was speaking earlier. Were you able to hear him? I think he didn't heard me too. Yeah, I don't think you can hear two of the speakers. Anthony and Seth was trying to speak. It was just. I mean, I'm a fan of bitd. I like what they do the vertical integration. They've got, you know, build their own miners. They do hosting, they do the self mining, they do the cloud hosting for individual retail investors.

Operational Strategies in the Mining Sector

They've got all the bases covered and they've got access to relatively cheap energy in some of their locations as well. So you know it's a good miner. But the question was about hosting as a business for some of the bigger miners. I just didn't see it happening for bitdeer. They'll tell you that it's worked for them and you've got to make a margin and your customer has to be able to pay. And theory sounds really good. I agree with theory. Penny was very good with theory. The theory is there. If, you know, if you can get your three cents a kilowatt hour margin and don't have to pay out for your own mining machines, and you get a nice margin from it.

Financial Viability and Cost Challenges

Yeah, that's great. But you've got to have really good energy prices to get that $0.03. Bear in mind, I think marathon is still paying something like 6.7 cents for their host contract at some of their sites because they've only got about. I think they've got less than 50% of their sites are owned by them. So they still have a big hosting contract with host providers and it's like six point six point seven cents. And if you look at what the hash price is today, that's going to be quite challenging to make any sort of margin on that type of number. So that's the challenge. You've got to be able to pay for this and if you're not getting enough rewards to cover that in terms of what you're getting from what you mined, it becomes a challenge.

Bitdeer's Performance Insights

But Bitdeer have managed it well over the last. Over the last cycle. I like their margins. I think Cypher and Terrawolf certainly came out with a lower net loss than bitdeer, but again, you're looking at two miners there that have the lowest power costs. I think Bitdishtal were also lower than Bitdir in terms of net loss as well, because they've got a great HPC contract which delivers as much revenues as their mining business delivers at the moment. But yeah, theory's good. It's the practical bit. I sort of like what's Bittier's goal for next year for their self mining X and Ash, was it? Oh, 4045 is it, Sebastian, for you? Over 40.

Market Expectations and Year-End Goals

Yeah. To get to 70. I don't know if 40 is self mining, but they want to go to 70 x ash total. I don't know if. Well, I don't think 70 is next year because they're only going to get to. They're only going to get to eleven by the end of this year. So that's what I said in the presentation. They have a presentation that Dr. Lewis posted and I. They aim for 70, but it's. Maybe it's not whole self mine, but it's 70. I don't know, I'm only. So I'm only talking about self mining. They do have a bigger. At the moment, their hosting business is bigger than their self mining business.

Funding and Capital Requirements for Growth

So I don't know if the hosting business is going to 30, but I think the last time I had an update and we have bit dear on the podcast, fairly regular, been on four or five times this year. So I'll go back and check, I'll check through the notes, but I'm sure it was like 44 or 45 next year, 11.3 this year, something like that. And they're going to get some. They're going to replace some of their miners this year for more efficient miners. That gets them the increased hash rate this year. But next year when they obviously going to roll out their own miner, the seal miner a one, seal miner a two, and grow that exponential next year.

Market Comparisons and Future Planning

But I mean, 60 exhaustion a year. I mean, you know, we want to see clean spark are going from, you know, ten to 32 this year. That's 22 exahash. Where do you think. Where do you think BITD is going to get the capital to go to 60? They have. I don't know how, but I know they have 200 million on this. On the 200 million gets you. What does 200 million get you? Sebastian gets you next. You're right. But they said in your podcast, in one of the, I think it was in January or February, I don't remember when, but they said that they can replace, transform their hosting business when the contract is done because some of their contracts are for a couple of months.

Evaluating the Infrastructure and Capital Needs

So when they have a total of 22, you know, so maybe they can. But you need capital to buy the miners to go into these sites that they've got. So where they were hosting, they have to replace it with miners. So they're going to need the capital to produce the miners themselves, which they look like. But it's going to be a lot. It's going to take a lot of money. They've just gone out and they raised 100 million with tether. I think there's 50 million warrants still available. They raised another 150 million recently. They've got an ATM. But this does, this is nowhere near get some sort of like 70 x a hash.

Market Strategies and Valuation Concerns

Nowhere near. So I. I'll go back and look at my notes. It's, I mean, it's about capital. I mean, you know, we've, we had one miner on who got like one extra hash. Anthony, I was sending to you now, the picture of me. I'm sure, but I haven't heard. Yeah, if you want to see, send. It to me now. Yeah, thanks. Yeah, but I think you just have to take a step back and listen. So we have, you know, I think it was Rob Shang said at the start. Yeah. They want once Griffin to get to ten extra hash. That was a ten from one to ten.

Production Challenges in the Mining Sector

And now we're in September and they're still at 0.9 or something like that. It's a challenge to get there. You need the money. Infrastructure, too, I think, correctly, if I'm wrong here, but I think a lot of their infrastructure is not coming online until like the middle of next year and then. Middle to the end of next year. Yeah, they've got a lot of. I mean they've got a lot of size 900. They've got, they've got two and a half gigawatts of potential out there. But they have 900 operational. 900 mw operational.

Forecasting Future Growth and Potential

Yeah. That's enough to get to what? To get to 70. I don't know if this is for 70, but. But probably nowhere near. Nowhere near. So how, how iron can get. What would it work? So what would. A hundred megawatts. What would that deliver? Six x. How many megawatts iron have that they can go to 40. Iron have got us. They've got. Well, they've got a number of sites they want. The children's site is 350 mw by the end of the year, but they've also got British Columbia and two other sites on top of that, so.

Capitalization and Strategic Planning

But it's the capital. It's the capital you need for the machines as well as. As well as completing the sites. So time will tell. Time will tell. But, you know, I don't think. Sorry. Dilution, probably no dilution. Yeah, but it's how, it's. How do you dilute with their, you know, with the level that they have to dilute to get their money? So. Yeah, yeah, I. Yeah, they got. They're at a billion dollars in market cap, so if marathon wants to dilute at 5 billion, it's a different ballgame.

Assessing Market Position and Investment Strategies

It's harder for us for a. You know, there are one of the smaller of the big miners in terms of where the market cap is at the moment. I think it's just under. I think it's under a billion at the moment. It might be like 900 and something. It's like bit farms. So bit farms, you know, they're growing to 21 this year, 35 next year. It's progressive, you know, but to go to eleven end of the year and then 70 next year, you need to back it up with serious amounts of capital. And if the bitcoin price gets to 200,000, might be having a different conversation. But at the moment it's.

Market Trends and Cyclical Behavior

I don't know, it's probably still under 59,000 today. It's not helping. And if September is going to be red, I listen to the technical guys because they're the. I don't do the technical stuff, I just do the fundamentals. But if, you know, it needs to. I mean, we're four months past the halving now. You know, in previous cycles, it started to move before now. So we're in that position now. When's it going to happen? And, you know, exactly like you said, I think, you know, we're getting to that point, man.

Speculation and Market Movements

But before we start really moving, you look at every big move bitcoin's done, there's always some type of huge drop. That's. That is before that big move. So I wonder which catalyst it's gonna be. I mean, if you look at the quad witching has always produced a pretty nasty drop, and then more. So I think what we're gonna have to wait on is the interest rate cuts. What happens? What are the odds of them doing a 0% cut? What would that do to the market if they did zero? Just out of curiosity, playing devil's advocate, anyone have any input?

Market Reactions and Economic Considerations

Well, I think it's going to be bad for the market because the market's kind of priced a little bit of at least a 25 basis points, if not a 50 basis points right now cut. I think it's pretty much a given that's going to happen. So if it doesn't happen, they go back in their word that zero, I think the market's going to drop. I mean, is there a case where. Then the outcome is either neutral or negative and not really a positive?

Investor Behavior and Market Patterns

I mean, I almost think that. Like. You see this in crypto with events and with news around cryptocurrency stuff, right? Where it's priced into the point where at best it's neutral, but usually there's a negative reaction. So I don't know, is there a case for it being taken wrong regardless of what it is, right. Like, either not enough or either too much. And because it's too much, it also instills, like, a sense of fear because you know that something's wrong.

Anticipation and Economic Signals

Why are they having to over correct so much? Why are they having to. I don't know, it's. I think it's interesting, but I'm always. A little bit, I think a fifth, exactly what you said. I think 50 basis cut is going to cause fear in the market just because then that shows that the economy isn't doing. Yeah, something's wrong. So 25 is going to be the secret sauce.

Market Sentiment and Projections

And I think there's a more likelihood of us experiencing a bad type of news from this compared to good size. David said equity would rise on no cut after a few days. You can grab the mic. David, I'd like to hear what your thoughts on what you think is happening with the economy. And. And this is more so your ballpark right here.

Market Insights from Participants

David, you want to talk about this? Trying to give you the mic. Yeah, because David loves to talk about this type of stuff, and he has good points, but, yeah, man, I think, you know, we'll see how the markets react leading up to September 18. What do you think, David? What do you think's on the menu for September? I don't know. They're kind of. They're kind of, like, not timed.

Reactions to Market Components

This probably won't be. I gotta. I gotta get back on. What's up? No, I have to jump. I have to jump for something. I'll be back in ten minutes. All right. Okay. I just wanted to add something. What do you think about the price per megawatt value, per megawatt that the HPC have? I don't know if you saw the interview with someone from Fidelity, I think, or Vanek.

Industry Comparisons and Operational Strategies

I think someone from Vanek talked on CNBC about the gap between the HPC businesses like Equinix, digital reality, and so forth, and he compared them to the bitcoin miners, and he said that the Equinix and all of those guys are priced with 30 million bitcoin miners are an average of three or 4 million. What do you think about who is the cheapest per megawatts that you see? Because I think it's bit dear, I'm sorry that I'm talking about it again, but 2.5 gigawatts and less than 1 billion, I think it's making them one of the cheapest miners per megawatts in the industry.

Investment Opportunities in the Emerging Market

And they want to go into the HPC business, and they can be very good at it, I think, because their CEO is know his stuff. And what do you guys think? That's a good question for Sebastian Anthony, who do you guys think is the cheapest in the industry per megawatt? I don't track them. Per megawatt. Probably could do it. Just look up the data that's available for each miner.

Valuation Metrics in the Market

But I don't do it. I do it by exahash to enterprise value, right? Yeah. I mean, per megawatts, kind of tough because they have a pipeline to get to 2.5 gigawatts. But when is that going to actually happen? Is it going to happen this bull run, or are we going to be doing that in the bear market? So, you know, potentially the next couple years. So that's the tough part there.

Future Goals and Milestones for Growth

They want to get it until the end of 2025 to add another 1.1 gigawatts. So they have something like 1.9 gigavolt, and then by the end of 2025, according what they say. Yeah, I mean, that's. Yeah, I mean, that's gonna be tough, though. I know a lot of the growth is not like we talked about earlier, middle of next year to end of next year and then into even 2026.

Investment Strategies and Market Uncertainties

But at that point, could, by the end of 2025, could be also at the end of the bear or the bull market, heading into a bear market at that point. So I think the market can invest pre like, because he can see that they have a pipeline, so he can invest accordingly. Like invest before they have even the 2.5 operational. Like iron. Everybody, everybody here very excited about the 2.3.

Market Dynamics and Strategic Insights

I don't know, three gigawatts of iron, and iron doesn't have three gigawatts right now, but it's still exciting because you can see where the company go. So if you know a company have a pipeline of 2.5 gigawatts, that they will have it by, I don't know, the end of 2026, the end of 2027, you can invest before they get to this kind of energy. And if the markets, like the AI HPC business, like we saw when Anthony came to riot, and core scientific and everyone asking only about the HPC businesses, so they don't mind to invest in a company before they have it operational.

Performance Metrics and Future Outlook

So that's kind of the difference there with the miners. I believe what the case is for them is that people are investing them for their hash rate growth, not their megawatt growth happening. So that's why you saw Irem, why it actually pumped really hard. Was it because they came out with new 30 x a hash by the end of this year, and then that was actually increased by ten x a hash. So that's the reason why it went up. The reason we saw Cleanspark go up also was because of their hash rate growth. So that's kind of where investors mindset is, at least right now.

Revenue Generation and Growth Potential

And then if you have the HPCI play, okay, well, core has the biggest customer there, but they obviously had a nice little pump here, but they're still not being valued on that. And that's mainly because we're still maybe nine months away before that actually materializes and they start getting revenue on it. So I think that's where it's really at. How quickly can they increase the revenue there, regardless of how many megawatts they're going to have down the line?

Valuation Insights

They're literally as much as a vertical integrated mine than any other miner because they're actually going to build their own machines over this next period now. So I like them. But if you're looking at the question that came out was about valuation of miners at the moment. And I put out a table today on x and that listed sort of like most of those mining companies that are at ten x a hash or above in terms of self mining. So I didn't include bitdre in that. And also bitdir's accounts don't follow gap, so you've got to start weeding through them a little bit to sort of determine some of the various things on the balance sheet. So I've asked them to report differently next time, so they'll take me up on that. But I did put out a tweet about eight of the sort of like the biggest miners and right looks at the moment, I mean the share price has disintegrated a little bit this year in terms of where it is now but it's starting to look value again compared to all the others. So you know they're a value play.

Comparative Analysis of Miners

I think hive digital is in that sort of mid tier bracket as certainly a value play. They just don't seem to get the recognition for what they're doing. They're a good operator, probably one of the best operators. Along with bit farms they keep the GNA costs low. We've talked about that tonight but they're just not getting the recognition from the market again. It's a Canadian miner. The difficulty in raising capital is a challenge to Canadian miners than it is for some of the US miners and so that's what you're up against. It's different, you know, different abilities for different types. So Cleanspark have managed it really well, riot Marathon have managed it really well. Terrawolf have used their atmosphere to a good extent this year they got rid of the debt, they've managed to grow. Cypher Mining, another us miner has done really well.

Capital and Market Position

So you can tick all the us mining companies. Look at the way hut eight turned around since they became USBTC. Sorry hut eight from the merger with USBTC, now based in Miami, not in Canada anymore. So they've moved location and one of the reasons for moving locations was liquidity is better in the US as a us based company so you get access to all the other indices. So like the Russell 3000 which means if you're on these other indices it means that institutional investors are then obliged to buy your stocks because you're part of the indices. Therefore you're in the basket of shares. You know if you want to say, you hear people say I want to put my pension or put some pension in the S and P 500, it means that your pension is going into those 500 companies, not two or three of them, all of them. And so when you go into these indices, marathon and riot and cleanspark, I think all three of them on the Russell 3000, which means they get far more access to institutional money being invested not because they're a bitcoin miner but because they're on the index they have to buy a share of every company.

Challenges with Different Mining Companies

And so you know, bit farms, hive, bitdeer don't get that same love. I mean BITD have just gone to the market with convertible notes for 150 million their interest rate because was it 8.5%? Which to means the market, it's not giving them the same opportunities. I mean, core scientific did theirs at 3%, marathon did at 2.25%. Bitdir is eight and a half percent. Now, it still sounds quite good compared to the interest rates two years ago, but this is in the same period, all doing convertible notes, but they're paying an extra five and a half percent interest rate. And on 150 million, that's a, that's a decent chunk of money that you've got to pay interest. So it is challenging times for some of the miners being able to grow. I mean, I've just looked at the.

Future Projections and Expectations

I've looked at you what you sent me there and, yeah, it says 40 by. So to get to eleven or twelve by the end of this year, 40 by middle of next year, that's another 30 x hash in the first six months, and then to get to 60 by the end of next year, that's going to be a challenge. Not in terms of they've got the power and probably got the facilities, but in terms of buying the machines or producing the machines to go into that facility, the capital required to do that is going to be astronomical. And how do they raise it when they're raising 150 million here, 100 million there, it's lots of hundreds of millions to do what they're trying to do. So I like what they're doing. I think they'll grow, but I don't think they'll grow as quickly as that presentation slide suggests. Maybe you can invite them and ask him about it, because it's important to know if they can really do it.

Historical Context and Targets

It's very big. 60 x ash. It's not. Well, I'll go back and tell you now. Go back to January 2023 and Cleansparts target was 20 x a hash by the end of 2023. And they got to ten. That was their target. They got to ten. And actually, how iron could manage to, in six months to go from one to 20? Go from. Sorry, go from six, you mean? in six months? I think they. Six. They had. They had six x ash at the start of the year iron. So go on. They went from six to 20. Yeah. All right. And by the end of the year, they will have a 30. So that's 24.

Short-Term Predictions and Market Dynamics

Yeah, that's 24. You're telling me 50 next year? Yeah, you're right. It's pretty ambitious. It's ambitious. It's gonna be. Yeah. Griffin mining said ten by the end of this year. They haven't moved. They haven't moved from one yeah. Griffin and they are small company, I think, in the. So, so being small, they can't get the capital. Is that correct? You're right. You're at. I agree. I'm agree. Yeah. You know, Anthony, I'm not sure I know you know your stuff. I honestly, I'm with you. I hope they get to 60 and I hope they do it. I'm just trying in my. I hope they will go to 40.

Market Influences and Financial Strategies

I even think, I think 40 by the end of next year is probably, you know, a bit more manageable. It all depends on bitcoin. It really depends on bitcoin price to generate some revenues that way to help fund it because they're just not going to be, you know, if you can imagine. I mean, the share price dropped massively when they announced 150 million ATM. They come out and do a, I mean, cleanspark, 800 million ATM, riot dollar, 750 ATM. Marathon did a 1.5 billion ATM. What sort of ATM do you think BITD could do once they've used up the 150 million without the market going pear shaped?

Returns and Market Reactions

You're probably right. You're probably right about it. Yeah. I'm just trying, I'm just trying to be practical. I mean, I might be wrong, but I've sort of like. In the four years in this space, I've seen many things. I've seen many sort of like predictions. Why tariff with, I don't know, ten x ash I think they have or what terror targets for 2020? 513 by the end of the year. End of 2025. They have a target. Nothing. Nothing. No increase. Okay, so. So 13 by the end of the year.

Portfolio Management and Market Sentiments

500 megawatt. Megawatts. Yeah. Yeah. BTR have, And looking for HPC client. Yeah. Bid. They're also searching for HPC clients. They have 800, 900 mw, they have a pipeline of 2.5 and they will have more exhaust than 1413 probably in 2025. Why would wolf worth 1.61.7 billion while bid dear? I know why. Because they not an american, not in the american exchange. Number of reasons. Their margins are fantastic. So their margins were greater than bitdeers, they had a lower net loss than bitdeer, they have a lower net loss.

Operational Efficiencies

Of Klintzberg and all the others. Yes, they did have lower net loss. They had a lower net loss of all. Most of the mining companies, Cypher was quite low as well, so. But they were worth before, more than bitter, even before Q two. But, I don't know, like it's just a gap. They got some of the cheapest energy. They've got a really good. They've got like two cent kilowatt hour at Nautilus and they've got a sort of market rate at the Lake Mariner site. So they've got a blended rate just over three and a half cents, something like that, which is quite cheap in the space.

Power Distribution and Strategic Planning

How many megawatts they are planning to go to HPC from their total of 500? I haven't got the number in front of me, but I'm assuming it's going to be probably half of that. 300 or. This is a good amount, but they left with 200 for bitcoin. I understand. When you say 300 is a good amount, I mean, does only core scientific got a reasonably good deal? Yeah, this is the only computer hive have got a hive are going to 30 mw, which is the equivalent of 300 bitcoin mining. So you know, when you say 300 mw isn't good, that's like three gigawatts of mining.

Mining Capacity Considerations

I said it's good. I said it's very good. It's very good. It's excellent. It's very good. Yeah, it's like core scientific. Core scientific are only at 382 watt megawatts at the moment. So it's not that much lower than. The only downside I see here is they left with only 200 mw for bitcoin mining. So the exhaust growth will be. It sounds like they're not interested in growing the bitcoin mining. It sounds like they're not even making an effort to grow it. And Cypher have turned around and said, so if you listen to the podcast with Tyler Page, I asked him a question because their black pearl site comes online next year full of miners.

Market Dynamics and Future Potential

And I said, if you get a reasonable offer for HPC and black pill, do you change your money? Went absolutely. Absolutely with that. I'm gonna let David take it real quick for a quick little spiel. Was good. David, how you feeling about the rate cuts and going into September? Love to hear your thoughts. Okay. First of all, because I want to get things clear, I ask people to watch things that I talk about watching, not to do things they think that I say okay, because I'm trying to give people signposts, not have them react and not see what's going on.

Market Trends and Aggregate Values

Now, in terms of this conversation you're having with miners, I could be wrong, but I believe the aggregate value of the entire mining universe is under $50 billion equity with a higher enterprise value, which is two basis points, the crypto space and the crypto space is about three or 4% of the Nasdaq. So you're talking about beta, hyper beta on beta, a lot of sensitivity. So what happened last week, that's important to keep note of? There are three main policymakers in the world right now, and policy will trump the system. Policy will trump prices.

Impacts of Policy and Market Control

When you have government involvement, monetary authority involvement, OPEC involvement, it will dominate prices for a short period of time, or they can accelerate their interference like a narcotic, but policy will, in the short term, always trump. So what happened? This guy Bostic, who I have been so fond of for so many years, Atlanta Fed, on the day that the CEO of dollar general announced my stocks down 33% because my people cannot afford pork, they're trading down to beans. And then bostic goes and says, well, oh, the GDP is fine.

The Influence of Economic Announcements

On average, everyone's doing fine. Meanwhile, the asset light people are struggling so mightily, and the asset long people are doing very well. So when he says, we don't need to cut in September, of course it's going to push down treasuries, and of course it's going to help stock because of this whole global margin call, which started on July 10. And there is absolutely nothing that can stop it. They can pause it, they can delay it, they can counter trend it, but gravity is attaching.

The Role of Inequities in Market Fluctuations

Nvidia is not worth 11% of GDP, and the malignant seven are not worth 60% of GDP. They will destroy everything. If they stayed at these values, they would take all the revenue, all the profits, kill all the banks. So what you have is bostic talking about not even cutting. Okay, that helps markets. But then I. You had a fantastic development on Thursday night after the market closed, and you had today in Germany. So what happened on Thursday?

Political Implications on Market Trends

Vice president Harris said, and I'm using paraphrasing, I'd like to get elected and I'd like to get reelected. So when I say I'm not in favor of fracking, take me at my word. And you know who listened to her? Mohammed bin Salman out of Saudi Arabia. OPEC plus. That why, that's why oil was down 3% on Friday. And initially you get wallet shift. Everyone's gaga, goo, oh, we got more money to spend because oil's going down and oil's going to break down.

Long-Term Outlook

Oil had its lowest monthly close of the year. That's not good because oil in the long basket of the system. The system right now is long tech, it's long crypto, it's long the malignant seven. And it's literally short everything else. Okay? It short bonds and short mortgages. And. And then what happens? We peak the Nasdaq, the malignant seven, on July 10, it melts down a considerable amount. You're talking about trillions of dollars. It is not about the yen.

Nikkei and Global Market Relations

The yen is one teeny piece of the short piece. The long piece is the nikkei. The long piece is commodities. The long piece is our tech, the milligan seven. And then the short piece. I would be a broken record if I didn't say to people, look at our pin tweet utility. Staples, healthcare have had 200 new highs in seven weeks. And the malignant seven had an apple new high on the 14 July.

Shifts in Market Strategies

And they had a meta a week ago Friday. Okay? There is no. And they could go higher, but they're underperforming everything else. And I always try to get people in the mind of their counterparties, not just if you're a retail investor, small institution who's on the other side, but really understanding what algorithms are doing institutions and hedge funds. So if you are an algorithm, you could say, hey, I'm going to short some utilities and I'm going to buy some Nasdaq 100, or I'm going to short some utilities and I'm going to buy some malignant seven on a dollar for dollar basis.

Algorithmic Trading and Market Adjustments

But if you're a more sophisticated algorithm, you're going to say, I'm not doing that. I'm going to short the implied volatility adjustment. So right now you got a 14 implied volatility of utilities. You got a 20 of the Nasdaq 100. It's a little higher of the malignant seven. So they're going to short 160% of utilities to neutralize the implied volatility. So instead of having tech up 22% and utilities up 21 and a half, utilities are actually up over 30% on a volatility adjusted cost of capital adjusted basis.

Government Interventions and Market Stability

These people are making money and you're not shaking that tree loose. And so when you have the August 5 recovery, that wasn't a recovery because people were buying stock, people who are like confident. That's because the government pushed down the treasuries that were running against the shorts were running against people's equity. And it doesn't matter that the yen came back down to the low. That's not going to trigger the problem.

Equity and Market Establishment

You need to destroy the equity that was evaporated on the 2 August that set up the gap down in japan -22 then our follow through and that emergency, that conference call, was not a conference call to cut rates. It was a conference call to push treasury prices down to make sure that margin call stopped happening. Okay. Bitcoin, David. So on bitcoin, it's leveraged. It's leveraged risk product. It's in the long basket.

Liquidation Risks in Commodities

It got to 49 with the liquidation. What's going to happen when oil rolls over? Okay. Kamala Harris said, I am not going to ban fracking. Saudi is sitting on 2 billion barrels with their cousins of annual production. That stuff is coming out. What happens when oils at 69 on the way to 59 on the way to 49, and then all of a sudden people start losing money on their commodity longs.

Interconnected Market Dynamics

The commodities all start melting down, and then you start having people bid notes. The bond is at a four month, four sequential month rally. The short, the rebate is rising. Policymakers had the European Central bank, with their massive quantitative tightening, pushing down their. Pushing down the prices of their treasuries, up the yield, and that pushed the dollar down. Where would bitcoin be? Where would the Nasdaq be if Christine Lagarde wasn't dumping more of their treasuries than Powell?

Economic Growth and Inflation Concerns

We'd have the dollar back towards the highs. And why are they doing this? Germany revised down their growth to negative on Thursday. Their inflation printed at 2%. Their nominal GDP is 1.9. Their GDP is -0.1 and ours was revised up to three. Okay. And they can continue to destroy their own currency, excuse me, their own economy, by driving their currency up.

Economic Outlooks and Trade Dynamics

Their exports are in contraction. Their GDP is in contraction. And why are they doing it? We all know why they're doing it. Because nobody wants to pay tariffs on everything, and no one wants NATO in Europe to have to pay 3% instead of two, which is what Trump is saying. So, rationally, they're just. They're tanking their treasuries and they're making the yield attractive and they're slowing the flow of money. But you look at the GDP we had the other day, they upgraded our net imports to 102 billion for the month.

Consumer Behavior and Economic Indicators

American consumers, especially the rich ones, are buying everything they want. They're just not buying it from american workers anymore. We're buying it from America and a lot of overseas. The savings rate fell to a 2005 low of 2.9%. Credit card credit lines are being reduced by Barclays and Capital one and these other places. And the reason they're doing that is because the lower end can't even afford to buy meat or chicken and now not even as much pork.

Overall Economic Health

So the economy is slowing it's the stock market's being held up because they interfered with the margin call and they can do it for a while. But when you see utility, staples, healthcare, financials, industrials just joining the new high list, that is losses showing up on shorts of them, which had shorted them for two years to buy the malignant seven again on our twin peat. October 28, 2022 by consumer Communications tech Discretionary the maximum outperformance for the next two years.

Upcoming Market Trends

The most outperformance we've had in 15 years. I mean, you couldn't get any more bullish than that. That's over. We're now experiencing the unwinding of that dispersion trade. And they couldn't slow it by saying, oh, we're going to push down treasuries and we're going to reduce the losses on the balance sheet of leveraged algos or leveraged hedge funds. But the long is suffering.

Policy Impact on Market Dynamics

And if oil is going down because Mohammed bin Salman heard Vice President Harris say, no, no, I'm all of the above. I want lower energy prices, I want lower inflation, I want lower interest rates. Lower interest rates are the enemy of crypto. Lower interest rates are the enemy of miners. Lower interest rates are the enemy of the malignant seven because that's what was rebated.

Market Influences and Future Projections

And I don't mean some nickel and dime 2.14% utility sector, which is now 2.6%. I'm talking about yet 51% of the market in this XLC, XLK, XLM tech discretionary. And then you've got to throw in what else is law. And there you got, you've got your oil, you've got your commodities, you've got problems everywhere. And now the shorts are rising.

Concluding Thoughts

Yeah, absolutely. And if you see the shorts rising while policymakers are trying to stop it, you know how screwed they are. Yeah, but good wrap up on that entire thing. I appreciate that, David. I'm going to get to this quick hand with good energy. Hey, happy Sunday, everybody. Energy is in my title. So my understanding, after two and a. Half years of learning from all the. Comm guys, canadian oil mafia, is that. You can say no ban on fracking.